Is this an illegal pitch

[paulg68]

We have a pitcher that starts with pivot foot on the rubber and non pivot foot touching the rear of the rubber within the width of the rubber( perfectly legal). When she pitches she lands with here non pivot foot outside the rubbers width when delivering the pitch. Most times the heal would land withing the rubber width but sometimes it is outside the rubber completely. She is basically stepping across here body to through a curve that starts at a right hand batter and breaks away. We really don't find anything in the book about the non pivot foot landing outside on delivery as being illegal unless it starts outside at the stance.

This is NFHS rules HS varsity softball

[MD Longhorn]

The entire pitch must be delivered from within that 24" width, when your pitcher is outside that, she's illegal.

[BretMan]

Originally Posted by paulg68

We really don't find anything in the book about the non pivot foot landing outside on delivery as being illegal...

You're just not looking hard enough.

See 6-1-2-b.

Once the hands are brought together and are in motion, the pitcher shall not take more than one step which must be forward, toward the batter and simultaneous with the delivery. Any step backward shall begin before the hands come together. The step backward may end before or after the hands come together.

NOTE: "Toward" is interpreted as within or partially within the 24-inch length of the pitcher's plate. (See "Figure")

In addition, the referenced "Figure" shows that the stride foot landing outside the 24" width is illegal.

[paulg68]

Originally Posted by BretMan

You're just not looking hard enough.

See 6-1-2-b.

Once the hands are brought together and are in motion, the pitcher shall not take more than one step which must be forward, toward the batter and simultaneous with the delivery. Any step backward shall begin before the hands come together. The step backward may end before or after the hands come together.

NOTE: "Toward" is interpreted as within or partially within the 24-inch length of the pitcher's plate. (See "Figure")

In addition, the referenced "Figure" shows that the stride foot landing outside the 24" width is illegal.

I saw that, but that shows the NP foot outside to start. So how you interpret that if her heel hits the rubber width line toward the catcher she would be legal then correct? As long as she starts with NP inside the rubber's width.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by paulg68

I saw that, but that shows the NP foot outside to start. So how you interpret that if her heel hits the rubber width line toward the catcher she would be legal then correct? As long as she starts with NP inside the rubber's width.

Starting or stopping does not matter, any of those with either foot outside "the lane" is illegal (the pitch/delivery, not the pitcher).

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by paulg68

I saw that, but that shows the NP foot outside to start. So how you interpret that if her heel hits the rubber width line toward the catcher she would be legal then correct? As long as she starts with NP inside the rubber's width.

If either foot is completely outside (i.e. NOT touching the 24" width at all) the 24", it's illegal. You seem hung up on whether the NP foot started inside or outside mattering wrt where it ends up. Keep in mind that 99% of the illegal pitches of this variety are exactly that... NP starting on the pitchers plate, and ending up 6 inches outside the 24" - doing that is illegal.

[paulg68]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

If either foot is completely outside (i.e. NOT touching the 24" width at all) the 24", it's illegal. You seem hung up on whether the NP foot started inside or outside mattering wrt where it ends up. Keep in mind that 99% of the illegal pitches of this variety are exactly that... NP starting on the pitchers plate, and ending up 6 inches outside the 24" - doing that is illegal.

Thanks for the feedback. Our pitcher starts well inside the 24" but her heel hits the line across here body when she throws a curve or change up. I was just concerned about 80% of her foot being out at delivery towards the plate. We actually put a line down to see how much or if she was outside the 24". We know coaches are going to say something because it is a good pitch and just want to have the facts that her foot touching the imaginary line constitutes a legal pitch. We don't have the lines on the field in our state for HS.

[Gulf Coast Blue]

Also....it is a pitching plate....not a rubber.....you would not want a British person to mistake your "rubber" for an eraser......

Joel

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Gulf Coast Blue

Also....it is a pitching plate....not a rubber.....you would not want a British person to mistake your "rubber" for an eraser......

Joel

I can live with coaches calling the pitching plate the rubber - after all, if you order one on line for your field, it's called a rubber on many sites.

What kills me are those that still say, "on the mound" in softball. I see no mound!

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

I can live with coaches calling the pitching plate the rubber - after all, if you order one on line for your field, it's called a rubber on many sites.

What kills me are those that still say, "on the mound" in softball. I see no mound!

The ignorance of on-line sales really shouldn't be a viable excuse. That is not really different than deciding interference and obstruction are interchangeable, or a foul tip back to the screen is acceptable language by umpires because enough other people don't know the difference.

As the people expected to know the proper terms, we are also the people expected to use them. Without exception, so that the proper terms ultimately rub off as common usage.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

The ignorance of on-line sales really shouldn't be a viable excuse. That is not really different than deciding interference and obstruction are interchangeable, or a foul tip back to the screen is acceptable language by umpires because enough other people don't know the difference.

As the people expected to know the proper terms, we are also the people expected to use them. Without exception, so that the proper terms ultimately rub off as common usage.

Don't get me wrong... I ALWAYS use the terms pitching plate, circle, etc, and properly use interference/obstruction (and correct people on this one when they say it wrong).

I was just saying that if some coach refers to a rubber in softball, I can live with it. Mound, however, drives me crazy. In fact, last year I had a coach call time, and then ask if he could go to the mound - my answer, "Sure, if you can find one, but the closest mound is over there (pointing to the baseball fields nearby)." He didn't get it.

[Gulf Coast Blue]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

I can live with coaches calling the pitching plate the rubber - after all, if you order one on line for your field, it's called a rubber on many sites.

What kills me are those that still say, "on the mound" in softball. I see no mound!

We all have our things that bother us........I tend to not let them bother me too much though......

Joel

[tcannizzo]

Was watching a college game on TV and one of the talking heads got a silent giggle out of me when he referred to the pitcher's plate as "the slab".

[Andy]

Originally Posted by Gulf Coast Blue

We all have our things that bother us........I tend to not let them bother me too much though......

Joel

Hear, Hear!

[Gulf Coast Blue]

It still disappoints me that I did not buy you a beer last June when I was in Tempe......oh well.......I cooked some ribs instead of looking you up.....that was my bad.

Joel