Timing Play

[MD Longhorn]

Manny, I hear you. But the fear of something weird like that happening shouldn't stop you from doing your best to get the call right. If BU points on a normal play when it appears the tag is made, helping PU decide if a run scores in time, it's helpful to the PU, and to the game.

If something weird happens, and he points, but the ball gets away, and THEN a tag is made anyway (how often does this happen anyway???), I would suggest he go talk with his partner and describe the play so he can make his best decision about the run. After all, we're a team out there. We've already acknowledged (with our rebellious timing play signal) to each other that there COULD be a play that we need to help each other out with... so when that happens - we should do what we can to help.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Manny A

The one situation I brought up where a point could be immature is when the umpire sees the initial tag, but the fielder loses possession of the ball (or never had it to begin with, and the umpire pointed in error), and then regains possession and applies a "real" tag of the runner before the runner safely touches the base.

I actually saw a play like this that happened in a high school state quarterfinal this year that I worked. I was U3, and there was R1 on third. The batter hit a slow roller to F5, and R1 took off for home. F5 threw low to F2, who went down on her knees to catch the ball. The ball arrived just before R1, who slid into F2 short of the plate. On the slide, the ball came out of F2's mitt, but landed on R1's leg. F2 was able and quick enough to grab the ball with her hand, completing the actual tag.

My PU partner was set up in such a way that he didn't see that the ball popped out of F2's mitt. He came up with the sell out signal before F2 regained possession of the ball. As it turned out, R1 was out, but the out actually happened after the PU's call.

If a similar play had happened at second or third base on a timing play, the sell call could have taken place before the runner touched home, but the actual out could have happened after the plate touch.

Yeah, I agree it's a rare situation. But it could happen.

And a meteor could land on the field, end up in the circle and the question will arise, "Is the LBR still in effect?"

After I teach the fingers on my left hand to grow up, I'll have my mature fingers turn to Page 30 of the 2012 ASA Rule Book and reference the definition of "tag". If I'm pointing at a timely tag, I'm pointing at an out. Subsequent action is irrelevant.

[SRW]

As someone important once told me, "Don't diminish the Power of the Point through overuse." Use it when it's necessary, and not when it's not.

[EsqUmp]

Originally Posted by Manny A

Other than when putting the ball in play, or when going to your partner for help on a checked swing, I didn't know a point signal was an appropriate mechanic to begin with.

The reason I don't like to point is because I may point prematurely (poor timing), seeing what I thought was a tag, only to subsequently see the fielder lose possession of the ball. If I point, the fielder loses possession, then she regains possession and can still make the tag for an out, my point will be for naught when it comes to the timing of the run scoring.

And since I don't point when it comes to other tag plays, I don't want to get into a possible bad habit of doing so.

It's not complicated. I'm sure you have enough self control not to make a habit of it. We don't point every time on a checked swing, but it does come in handy. I don't point on every full swing now. It's a little over-cautious to think you couldn't do it correctly.

"TAG" does not imply anything other than the fact that there was ... a tag.

If the plate umpire hears "tag" before the runner crosses the plate and the out occurs (assuming they don't over-slide the base or anything odd that I have not seen in 3000 games), then no run. If "tag" occurs after the runner hits the plate, then score the run. If "tag" occurs before the runner crosses but there is no out, easy enough - continue the inning.

Give it a try. It's not at all difficult. I have full faith that even a first year umpire can say "tag" and not make a habit of it.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by irishmafia

"is the lbr still in effect?"

lol :d