Fly Ball Coverage SNAFU

[NCASAUmp]

Didn't ASA's own video show the BU go out from B?

I once had a UIC tell me I should never be any closer than 18 feet on ANY call, PERIOD. That included tag plays. He was adamant that it was in the Umpire Manual.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

Didn't ASA's own video show the BU go out from B?

I once had a UIC tell me I should never be any closer than 18 feet on ANY call, PERIOD. That included tag plays. He was adamant that it was in the Umpire Manual.

We all know that's not in the manual... but it's not a horrible bit of advice. Angle is more important than distance, and TOO close can often be a problem. 6 yards is really not that far from a play and lets you see everything (most of the time). Closer and you're cutting down on periphery --- not always bad, but often bad.

That said ... I think PU would have to move backward without looking to reach 18 feet on the typical PB/play at the plate - not something I'd think a UIC should be advocating!

PS ... ANY call? Hope he calls his balls and strikes from less than 18 feet away!!!

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

We all know that's not in the manual... but it's not a horrible bit of advice. Angle is more important than distance, and TOO close can often be a problem. 6 yards is really not that far from a play and lets you see everything (most of the time). Closer and you're cutting down on periphery --- not always bad, but often bad.

That said ... I think PU would have to move backward without looking to reach 18 feet on the typical PB/play at the plate - not something I'd think a UIC should be advocating!

PS ... ANY call? Hope he calls his balls and strikes from less than 18 feet away!!!

It's not terrible advice, but claiming that 18' on tag plays is found in the manual? No, it's not.

I'll put it in more specific context. He asked me how far away I should be on a play. I asked, "tag or force?" He said, "doesn't matter." I responded, "well, the book says 10-12 feet on a tag, and 18-21 feet on a force."

He said, "no, the book says no less than 18' feet on all plays."

I understand if that's his perspective, and from that moment on, that's exactly what I gave him for the rest of the tourney. But claiming that the book backs him up? No. Not good.

Coincidentally, I was the second person to whom he'd asked that question, and I was the second person who gave the exact same answer. That should have told him something.

[DaveASA/FED]

You know that's when I pull out the book and play stupid. Sorry mr/mrs UIC I am confused. After we talked the other day I went back and double checked the book and here on page XX it says 12-15 feet on a tag play, you were telling me at least 18 feet....I'm confused can you go over this again? I'm missing something.

That way you don't even tell your UIC they are crazy, but you get them into the book (and some of them need it as much or MORE than the umpires they are directing) and also gets your point accross without being a smarta** well that is if you do it right, takes a little acting to seem honest in the 'trying to learn' approach and not the here it is in the book moron that it can come accross as.

[IRISHMAFIA]

I wonder if this umpire confused this with the 18'-21' beyond 1B when working the line with how far one should set up for a play.

Unfortunately, it is not unusual for people who don't routinely attend clinics to hear somethings. If they do not follow up, it seems some of these people get a number in their head and hang their hat on it, right or wrong.

[BretMan]

At a clinic last year, one of the instructors chided me because when I was in the "A" position and walking the line, I took two steps instead of one. He actually made a big deal out of it, stopping the drill we were doing and pulling me aside so that he could show everyone "the right way".

At another clinic, we were doing plate work. I set up with my eyes at the top of the strike zone. One instructor told me that I was setting up too low. Later that day, another instructor told me I was setting up too high!

[jr131981]

Originally Posted by BretMan

At a clinic last year, one of the instructors chided me because when I was in the "A" position and walking the line, I took two steps instead of one. He actually made a big deal out of it, stopping the drill we were doing and pulling me aside so that he could show everyone "the right way".

At another clinic, we were doing plate work. I set up with my eyes at the top of the strike zone. One instructor told me that I was setting up too low. Later that day, another instructor told me I was setting up too high!

ive never understood the whole walking the line concept

from pg 246 of the 2011 ump manual

"walk the line by taking one or two steps toward home plate, pushing off with your left foot to move off the foul line when the ball is batted"

for groundballs to an IFer, why do i have to walk 1-2 steps down the line then move into position to make the call at 1B? why not just move into position right away?

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by DaveASA/FED

You know that's when I pull out the book and play stupid. Sorry mr/mrs UIC I am confused. After we talked the other day I went back and double checked the book and here on page XX it says 12-15 feet on a tag play, you were telling me at least 18 feet....I'm confused can you go over this again? I'm missing something.

That way you don't even tell your UIC they are crazy, but you get them into the book (and some of them need it as much or MORE than the umpires they are directing) and also gets your point accross without being a smarta** well that is if you do it right, takes a little acting to seem honest in the 'trying to learn' approach and not the here it is in the book moron that it can come accross as.

I wasn't going to sweat it, as I knew I wouldn't see him again. I just hope I planted the seed in his head that multiple umpires might not be wrong when they're all saying "10-12 feet on a tag play."

[BretMan]

I got another newsflash from an expert umpire last weekend...

He and I were the base umpires in a three-man crew for the championship game on Sunday. As U1, whenever he counter-rotated off the line he came all the way around to the "C" position.

When I mentioned to him that he really only needed to be in "B", he went into a longwinded explanation of how he had worked college games the day before and that was the "new" mechanic they were using.

Then he dazzled me with his insight about the new college "delayed dead ball for leaving early rule" and how they work "the rim/outside the diamond"...and how ASA would be adopting both of these next year!

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by BretMan

Then he dazzled me with his insight about the new college "delayed dead ball for leaving early rule" and how they work "the rim/outside the diamond"...and how ASA would be adopting both of these next year!

Sounds like he was wrong a lot. But he might be right on the rim in specific situations - I had an assignor / UIC tell me the same regarding 2-man mechanics on a steal of 2nd, especially one that is not drawing a throw.