Ending Game

You may be correct but I'm being devil's advocate. In the case book 1B is also an awarded base that was failed be touched. would 2nd or 3rd be treated any differentially?

[CecilOne]

Aren't you glad we don't hear appeals as a group?

Of course, then there would be specific rule, a little easier.

We could all get together and vote

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by softball_junky

You may be correct but I'm being devil's advocate. In the case book 1B is also an awarded base that was failed be touched. would 2nd or 3rd be treated any differentially?

That is the crux of the discussion. Speaking NFHS, show me where R1 in the OP situation being ruled out negates the run:

NFHS 9-1-1

EXCEPTION: A run is not scored if the runner advances to home plate during action in which the third out is made as follows:
a. by the batter-runner before touching first base;
b. by another runner being forced out;
c. by the preceding runner who is declared out because of failing to touch one of the bases;
d. when a third out is declared on an appeal play resulting in a force out (This play takes precedence if enforcing of it would negate a score.);
e. when there is more than one out declared by the umpire which terminates the half-inning (the defensive team may select the out which is to its advantage);
f. when a runner crosses home plate after a preceding runner is declared the third out.

I would say B and D

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by softball_junky

I would say B and D

It is not a force out; it is a base award. At best, the runner is out for missing a base on an awarded base, but it is not a force out.

Going back to the case book. 1B is an awarded base as well. BR is called out on appeal and no run scores. So why would 2nd and 3rd base be treated any differently?

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by softball_junky

Going back to the case book. 1B is an awarded base as well. BR is called out on appeal and no run scores. So why would 2nd and 3rd base be treated any differently?

Because they are not specifically mentioned in the rules and BR is, even if base-on-balls was not the intent.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by softball_junky

You may be correct but I'm being devil's advocate. In the case book 1B is also an awarded base that was failed be touched. would 2nd or 3rd be treated any differentially?

Yes... the difference is this: "by the batter-runner before touching first base"

Well I will keep checking back until we can get a definitive answer. This happens a lot during Rec season. There are run limits per inning and often on walks not all the runners touch the next base. We treat it as an appeal. Most of the time the coaches don't even notice.

[PSUchem]

"It is not a force out; it is a base award. At best, the runner is out for missing a base on an awarded base, but it is not a force out."

But it is a base to which the runner is forced, regardless of whether it is an award. Isn't this a similar play:

Bases loaded, two outs, B4 hits a grand-slam over the fence. R3, who started on 1B, misses 2B. After everyone has crossed the plate, defensive fielder appeals that R3 missed 2B. How many runs score? None, because the runner missed the base to which they were "forced." All of the runners were "awarded" home on the ball hit out of play on the homerun.

So how is the OP any different? Are you saying that because I can't throw the ball to 2B to retire R3, and it is an awarded base, it is not possible to have a "force" on an appeal?