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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 09:10am
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Question 2 runners on a base

R1 on 2nd, R2 on 1st, no outs. B3 bunts up 3rd base line. F5 throws to 1st for the out. For some reason R1 starts running late, F3 throws the F6 on 3rd and R1 gets in to a pickle. R2 is already on second and is not moving. Eventually R1 and R2 are on second. The fielder with the ball first tags R1 and the BU calls safe then she tags R2 and he calls out.
My understanding is the first runner to legally occupy the base is entitled to the base. (8-3-E-Effect). I understand that the force was off once B3 was put out at 1st. However, I still believe R1 should have been called out not R2. The only reason this matters is because R1 is fast and R2 is slow.
Did my partner get it right?
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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 09:36am
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Why would an umpire care who was faster?

The rule is pretty clear as you so eloquently stated it..
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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 10:04am
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Originally Posted by vcblue View Post
...Did my partner get it right?
Yes.
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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 10:06am
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Originally Posted by vcblue View Post
R1 on 2nd, R2 on 1st, no outs. B3 bunts up 3rd base line. F5 throws to 1st for the out. For some reason R1 starts running late, F3 throws the F6 on 3rd and R1 gets in to a pickle. R2 is already on second and is not moving. Eventually R1 and R2 are on second. The fielder with the ball first tags R1 and the BU calls safe then she tags R2 and he calls out.
My understanding is the first runner to legally occupy the base is entitled to the base. (8-3-E-Effect). I understand that the force was off once B3 was put out at 1st. However, I still believe R1 should have been called out not R2. The only reason this matters is because R1 is fast and R2 is slow.
Did my partner get it right?
In the game chronology, who was the FIRST runner of the two to occupy second base?
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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 10:06am
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Originally Posted by Dakota View Post
Yes.
Ahhhh...you went and gave him the answer!
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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 10:28am
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Originally Posted by wadeintothem View Post
Why would an umpire care who was faster?...
Because if the declares the faster runner out, leaving the slower runner on base, he increases his chances of getting to the third out of the inning quickly!
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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 10:52am
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Originally Posted by Dakota View Post
Because if the declares the faster runner out, leaving the slower runner on base, he increases his chances of getting to the third out of the inning quickly!
That is an excellent point - like wise, with a tie score, you would want to call out the slower runner!

That vcblue is always thinkin!

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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 11:27am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vcblue View Post
My understanding is the first runner to legally occupy the base is entitled to the base. (8-3-E-Effect).
Is this NFHS or ASA? I don't do ASA, so not familiar with that rules set, but 8-3-E and its effect (NFHS) states that the runner who first legal occupied the base shall be entitled to it. R1 had occupied second base before the pitch. She lost that right when she was forced to move on the bunt, but doesn't she regain that right when the force was removed after the batter-runner was put out at first? In such a case, won't it be the trailing runner than would be declared out, if tagged?
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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 11:36am
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Originally Posted by TwoBits View Post
Is this NFHS or ASA? I don't do ASA, so not familiar with that rules set, but 8-3-E and its effect (NFHS) states that the runner who first legal occupied the base shall be entitled to it. R1 had occupied second base before the pitch. She lost that right when she was forced to move on the bunt, but doesn't she regain that right when the force was removed after the batter-runner was put out at first? In such a case, won't it be the trailing runner than would be declared out, if tagged?
Yeah, that is what happened.
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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 11:36am
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In getting ready to go to the 18A Western National I am think that coaches will be a little more savvy then 12A Travel Daddy Coaches, and they may bring it up in order to have a faster runner in scoring position.

TwoBits brings up the question that we all I have talked to have, "R1 had occupied second base before the pitch. She lost that right when she was forced to move on the bunt, but doesn't she regain that right when the force was removed after the batter-runner was put out at first? In such a case, won't it be the trailing runner than would be declared out, if tagged"?
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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 11:39am
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Originally Posted by wadeintothem View Post
That is an excellent point - like wise, with a tie score, you would want to call out the slower runner!

That vcblue is always thinkin!

I also have two watches that are same except one is two minutes faster
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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 12:11pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA View Post
Yeah, that is what happened.
Oops. Got R1 and R2 switched around in my head.
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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 01:43pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dakota
Yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skahtboi View Post
Ahhhh...you went and gave him the answer!
Just note that someone finally asked a question that Tom only needed one word to answer. Mike used 5.
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Old Wed May 20, 2009, 02:40pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CecilOne View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dakota
Yes.


Just note that someone finally asked a question that Tom only needed one word to answer. Mike used 5.


I've just been amused at all of the words in this thread AFTER my succinct reply!
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Old Tue Jun 02, 2009, 09:07pm
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lead runner is entitled to base, unless it is a force play, where then the lead runner is entitled to the base he is forced to...
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