Fair/foul call

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by MNBlue

ASA 1.Fair Ball.F
A legally batted ball that:
First falls or is first touched on or over fair territory beyond first, second or third base.

Actually, this is referring to a fly ball hit beyond 1B or 3B. You actually want...

ASA-1-Fair Ball-B:
Bounds over or past first or third base, which is in fair territory, regardless of where the ball hits after going over the base.

And, conversely...

ASA-1-Foul Ball-A:
Settles or is touched (not caught) on or over foul territory between home and first base or between home and third base.

While I agree with Mike's interpretation that this would be a foul ball, I wonder if ASA will clarify this someday. This "line" we're hearing about is, well, interesting. I'd prefer using the baselines and not some diagonal.

[MNBlue]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

Actually, this is referring to a fly ball hit beyond 1B or 3B. You actually want...

No, I don't think so.

The scenario is a fly ball that lands beyond a diagonal from 1B to 3B BUT in front of the baselines from 1B-2B-3B and subsequently rolls into foul territory not beyond 1B or 3B.

I'm saying that ASA says this is a foul ball and the interpretation I was given for NFHS is that it is a fair ball.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by MNBlue

No, I don't think so.

The scenario is a fly ball that lands beyond a diagonal from 1B to 3B BUT in front of the baselines from 1B-2B-3B and subsequently rolls into foul territory not beyond 1B or 3B.

I'm saying that ASA says this is a foul ball and the interpretation I was given for NFHS is that it is a fair ball.

Sorry, I should have also quoted A...

ASA-1-Fair Ball-A: Settles or is touched on or over fair territory between home and first base or between home and third base.

I think you need to read the wording a little closer. A, B and E deal with everything from home plate to the square formed by the baselines. F, G and H deal with everything beyond that.

I agree with you that both ASA and NFHS need something to handle this scenario, and I have no problem with your call. Just which rule you're invoking.

[MNBlue]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

F, G and H deal with everything beyond that.

Exactly. That is why I used it. ASA 1.Fair Ball.F says an untouched batted ball that lands beyond the diamond will be a fair ball even if it rolls into foul territory. This means that an untouched batted ball that lands inside the diamond and rolls into foul territory will be a foul ball.

The interpretation of the NFHS rule is in conflict with this.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by MNBlue

Exactly. That is why I used it. ASA 1.Fair Ball.F says an untouched batted ball that lands beyond the diamond will be a fair ball even if it rolls into foul territory. This means that an untouched batted ball that lands inside the diamond and rolls into foul territory will be a foul ball.

The interpretation of the NFHS rule is in conflict with this.

So you use the inverse of a rule as a rule?

Are you in IT, by any chance?

If using this logic, then the tie must definitely go to the runner. Just picking.

[MNBlue]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

Are you in IT, by any chance?

I used to be.

I would have used any of the cites in 1.Foul Ball, but none of them seemed to apply to the situation. The closest was the inverse of 1.Fair Ball.F.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by MNBlue

I used to be.

Damn! I called that one! Must take one to know one.

Originally Posted by MNBlue

I would have used any of the cites in 1.Foul Ball, but none of them seemed to apply to the situation. The closes was the inverse of 1.Fair Ball.F.

Again, that's my problem with the wording. I realize this has probably a one in a million chance of happening, but when it does happen, we want some clarity. A diagonal, in my opinion, is no good, as we have nothing on the field to reference one (what? we want more lines?!). I think what is INTENDED is for us to use the baselines, and that's what I'll call.

[IRISHMAFIA]

What is so hard about this? This is simple. The definitions note specifics that make a batted ball fair or foul.

It is not a matter that the batted ball meets an event-specific definition. The point is the batted ball does NOT meet the definition of a fair ball, therefore cannot be a fair ball.

[Tex]

Foul ball in both ASA and NFHS. Ball did not touch or go past 1st base. Simple as that. Don't understand the confusion. The ball can touch in right field, spin back toward 1st base, and go over the foul line between home and 1st base. All of this without being touched. The result is a foul ball.