who should call fair or foul?

[Illinois blue]

in a two umpire game and no one on base, I think the base ump should call a ball hit down the rt. field line, fair or foul. Have you ever been blocked out?

[Andy]

Originally posted by Illinois blue
in a two umpire game and no one on base, I think the base ump should call a ball hit down the rt. field line, fair or foul.

I don't have a problem with this statement. I won't put an "always" or a "never" in front of it, however.

Have you ever been blocked out?

Sure....who hasn't?

[shipwreck]

In a two man with noboby on why not as BU go out to watch for fair or foul and if there is a catch or not. Dave

[Little Jimmy]

Maybe my area is different than others but the foul line on 95% of all my fields isn't lined much more than 10-15 feet beyond the bag. If I go out in the A position for a fair/foul call I have nothing to judge it off of. Plate guy can at least see the line and extend it from his/her perspective.

[Antonella]

First: on a batted ball to the out field first reaction of base umpire is basically expected to move toward the infield.
In Two Ump.s System this movement will be toward the circle.
In Three or Four Ump.s System this movement (not always, but most of the times) will be along the foul line, in foul territory.
PRIORITY of base umpire is batter-runner.
Plate Umpire's priority, on the other hand, is fair/foul call on the batted ball.

So my answer is: fair/foul is for PU.
BU could help (if requested), but at the moment that batted ball is 'landing'... he/she is probably checking something else...

JMO

Ciao

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by shipwreck
In a two man with noboby on why not as BU go out to watch for fair or foul and if there is a catch or not. Dave

In a perfect world, I would agree. However, not every field is properly lined. If there are no lines, I would leave the fly balls near the line to the PU.

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally posted by shipwreck
In a two man with nobody on why not as BU go out to watch for fair or foul and if there is a catch or not. Dave

For consistency reasons. In many (if not most) cases, consistency needs to be the mantra for universal coverage. the plate umpire knows he has fair/foul calls ALL the time when the ball is hit to left, and every catch/no catch call when the ball is hit to left, to center, and ... sometimes when the ball is hit to right?

And, in slow pitch, with nobody on, the base umpire starts in B position, and has no angle for fair/fou calls, even if the field is properly lined.

The clearest and most simple message to get out to 60,000 ASA umpires, and unknown other umpires not registered with ASA, is that the plate umpire has all fair/foul calls, and all catch/no catch calls. Base umpire is to buttonhook and pick up baserunners. All the time, no matter what field the ball is hit to, whether fast pitch, slow pitch, or modified.

Can higher level umpires vary from that? Sure, if you communicate; but teach the KISS method.

[bkbjones]

There was an effort to do this a few years ago, with disastrous results. Too many cases of BU calling a ball fair (or foul) and the PU ruling the opposite way.

This was probably more a case of communications, and too many folks not doing a pregame...but it was a disaster.

[JFA67]

Interesting discussion. In my career working HS, ASA and NCAA, the answer is it depends.

This is something to cover in your pregame. if the line isn't marked, the plate umpire has to take it to use the foul pole to judge it.

On the other hand, in three person, it is the base umpire's job in the situation you describe.
That is what I was taught at both ASA national school and the NCAA evaluation tournament I worked several years ago.

If my information is out of date, someone correct me.

[booker227]

And if it drops inside the foul line, who's covering first? Plate umpire's responsibility because on any hit the base umpire should be moving inside the diamond to their position. The base umpire shouldn't turn their back on the infield unless they're looking for the trap.

[JFA67]

The plate umpire has the single runner at first in 2 person in the situation described. .
Like I mentioned in my previous post - cover this in the pregame. Some umpires prefer the base umpire in 2 person almost always (except possible trap) move inside the diamond.
3 person mechanics dictate the base umpire has that call.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by bkbjones
There was an effort to do this a few years ago, with disastrous results. Too many cases of BU calling a ball fair (or foul) and the PU ruling the opposite way.

This was probably more a case of communications, and too many folks not doing a pregame...but it was a disaster.

John,

I think you are referring to a bounding ball that reaches the base. Yes, it was a mess.

I believe the OP referred to a ball in flight near the RF line.

[CecilOne]

We're now being taught to go out from A on any ball on the foul line side of F9 ("outside the V") and leave the PU with all base calls.

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally posted by CecilOne
We're now being taught to go out from A on any ball on the foul line side of F9 ("outside the V") and leave the PU with all base calls.

Who is "we", and who or what organization is doing that teaching?

[CecilOne]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by AtlUmpSteve

Originally posted by CecilOne
We're now being taught to go out from A on any ball on the foul line side of F9 ("outside the V") and leave the PU with all base calls. [/QUOTE
Who is "we", and who or what organization is doing that teaching?

]"We" are the umpires in our ASA/NFHS association being taught by our in-house instructors.