Slow Pitch Umps

[archangel]

How ironic that after 30 yrs of pitching- maybe 1000 Sp games played, and 10 years of umping SP and varsity baseball, I have never seen or heard of that "mechanic".....

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by archangel

How ironic that after 30 yrs of pitching- maybe 1000 Sp games played, and 10 years of umping SP and varsity baseball, I have never seen or heard of that "mechanic".....

Well, you are not going to see it in baseball, but if you never saw it in 1000 SP games, you must have been blessed with well-trained umpires.

Yeah, I know, what's this world coming to!!!

[Dakota]

I have a question: Why is it necessary, or even good, for the umpire to make sure that all the players know the reason for a pitch being called a BALL?

[ukumpire]

It is my believe, (and I read part of it somewhere in this thread) that the 'fists together' is only done at lower end slowpitch, and it is normally only done when that 12" or 11" sucker hits the ground and edge of plate simultaneously, thus still causing a bounce. If it is straight edge of plate then it slides or spins to the ground. Certainly in ISF and I believe in ASA this is not the norm for the umpire to assist the pitcher, but it is infact the catchers duty to inform the pitcher. We do not have signs for inside / outside, so why a ball on plate. Let the catcher at least do something in slowpitch than just throwing it back to the pitcher after every ball! Well, okay, they also cover 1st after a hit!!! The point is that you will never see it for obviuos reasons in fast or baseball ... And if that young man has never seen the signal after 1000 games pitching and umpiring then all I can say is WOW ...

[Skahtboi]

I guess to me, the "hitting the plate" mechanic being described is pretty pointless. It is a case where the umpire, usually unsure of himself, feels the need to tell everyone where the pitch was, like verbally calling "inside" or "low" or "high" or "outside." One of my favorites I heard one of these directions givers use was "at the knees," but we won't go into the problems inherent with that. I don't see why the umpire just doesn't call "off the plate," or something of that nature, rather than using the "fist indicator."

[ukumpire]

Better still - 'Don't Call Nothing'
Okay end of this thread for me . it's too long

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

... It is a case where the umpire, usually unsure of himself, feels the need to tell everyone where the pitch was, like verbally calling "inside" or "low" or "high" or "outside." ...

That is not limited to slow pitch umpires. And, I agree, that it seems to me to indicate a lack of confidence - trying to forestall the griping and such. The most I do in this regard is the slight "look" or head movement in the direction of where the pitch missed (but, I'm talking FP, not SP).

If the catcher asks, I'll answer. If the coach asks I'll sometimes answer; sometimes I'll tell the catcher what to tell the coach.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by ukumpire

...Okay end of this thread for me . it's too long

Gosh, what would you have done with the background investigation thread!

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Dakota

Gosh, what would you have done with the background investigation thread!

Want to find out?????

[SRW]

Originally Posted by jimpiano

A hand signal that helps them understand is hardly a tool that should be held against an umpire. The double fist is appropraite at some levels and not needed in others.

I simply thank whoever invented it becauase it has been a useful tool over the years in letting all the players in the field know what happened.

I'm still confused.

If the ball is hit and fouls back to the fence, do you do your little fist pumping action for that dead ball?

Or if there's an interference call from the runner who crashed into F4 about to receive the batted ball - fist pump? Maybe a double fist pump since two people collided?

What about when Sheri the Office Manager fouls one into her right foot? Is that a "fist-to-foot pump" mechanic? Does it change if it's her left foot?

No of course you don't do those mechanics. Why? Because they're not prescribed mechanics.

So why the hell do you "fist pump" when it hits the plate?

A ball that hits the plate is dead. Period. Give the Dead Ball signal (stealing or not), then call the ball. The If the players ask you why it's a dead ball, tell them why. But don't be using lazy-assed, sandlot mechanics.

PS: is your last name Gilman?

[jimpiano]

Unless there is stealing, the result of any legal pitch that is not swung at is a dead bal in slow pitch. Why would you use a dead ball signal for a pitch that hit the plate? If you use it to let everyone know that the reason the pitch is a ball is beause it hit the plate, how is that any differnt than a double fist?

Why in the world you jump on umpires who use the double fist is beyond me.

[jimpiano]

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

I guess to me, the "hitting the plate" mechanic being described is pretty pointless. It is a case where the umpire, usually unsure of himself, feels the need to tell everyone where the pitch was, like verbally calling "inside" or "low" or "high" or "outside." One of my favorites I heard one of these directions givers use was "at the knees," but we won't go into the problems inherent with that. I don't see why the umpire just doesn't call "off the plate," or something of that nature, rather than using the "fist indicator."

If you don't like the mechanic, dont use it.

[bkbjones]

Originally Posted by jimpiano

If you don't like the mechanic, dont use it.

Don't worry, we won't.

[BretMan]

Originally Posted by jimpiano

Why in the world you jump on umpires who use the double fist is beyond me.

Okay. I'll take a crack.

(But somehow I doubt that you're going to listen to me any more than you've listened to anyone else here.)

Because this is not an approved signal as desribed in any umpire manual that I am aware of.

I don't know what your situation is, as far as local associations, evaluations or game assignments are concerned. For me, if I am being evaluated and use non-standard signals I can count on being dinged by the evaluator. This can stifle advancement and lead to fewer game assignments.

If you start using non-approved signals, where do you draw the line? Should umpires have their own set of signals to use however they see fit?

Here's a line from the ASA umpire manual:

"The adopted signals are dignified, informative, meaningful, and therefore, shall be used by all umpires. Poorly executed and unauthorized signals serve only to confuse."

Since these are the guidelines I'm evaluated under, I do not use non-standard signals.

[jimpiano]

Originally Posted by BretMan

Okay. I'll take a crack.

(But somehow I doubt that you're going to listen to me any more than you've listened to anyone else here.)

Because this is not an approved signal as desribed in any umpire manual that I am aware of.

I don't know what your situation is, as far as local associations, evaluations or game assignments are concerned. For me, if I am being evaluated and use non-standard signals I can count on being dinged by the evaluator. This can stifle advancement and lead to fewer game assignments.

If you start using non-approved signals, where do you draw the line? Should umpires have their own set of signals to use however they see fit?

Here's a line from the ASA umpire manual:

"The adopted signals are dignified, informative, meaningful, and therefore, shall be used by all umpires. Poorly executed and unauthorized signals serve only to confuse."

Since these are the guidelines I'm evaluated under, I do not use non-standard signals.

I have neer been dinged by any evaluator, or anyone, for using the double fist to signify the ball hitting the plate.