Force at second if batter is out at first?

[BDevil15]

Ok, I am very new to softball coaching but played baseball like 40 years ago so forgive me. Does anyone have a rules citation for this play?

Runner at first with no outs. Runner takes a small lead and the ball is hit sharply to first. First baseman steps on first to put the batter out. Runner heads to second and slides into second just after the ball arives. There was no tag. Is this still a force when the runner behind her is already out? I though that she had to be tagged but was completely overruled. I can't find this specific situation in my brand new rulebook so hope someone can help.

Thanks,
Coach B

[Crabby_Bob]

No, a tag is necessary. Overruled by whom? What rule book?

[TexBlue]

When the BR was put out, the force no longer existed for the runner on first. A tag is necessary for the out.

[Cliffdweller]

Originally Posted by BDevil15

Ok, I am very new to softball coaching but played baseball like 40 years ago so forgive me. Does anyone have a rules citation for this play?

Runner at first with no outs. Runner takes a small lead and the ball is hit sharply to first. First baseman steps on first to put the batter out. Runner heads to second and slides into second just after the ball arives. There was no tag. Is this still a force when the runner behind her is already out? I though that she had to be tagged but was completely overruled. I can't find this specific situation in my brand new rulebook so hope someone can help.

Thanks,
Coach B

Actually the runner would be out for "taking a small leadoff"...

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by BDevil15

Ok, I am very new to softball coaching but played baseball like 40 years ago so forgive me. Does anyone have a rules citation for this play?

Runner at first with no outs. Runner takes a small lead and the ball is hit sharply to first. First baseman steps on first to put the batter out. Runner heads to second and slides into second just after the ball arives. There was no tag. Is this still a force when the runner behind her is already out? I though that she had to be tagged but was completely overruled. I can't find this specific situation in my brand new rulebook so hope someone can help.

Thanks,
Coach B

Actually, the moment that R1 stepped off 1B, the Ball became Dead and R1 is Out.

MTD, Sr.

[Rich Ives]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Actually, the moment that R1 stepped off 1B, the Ball became Dead and R1 is Out.

MTD, Sr.

Actually you can take a small lead as soon as the pitcher releases the pitch.

[Tru_in_Blu]

Originally Posted by Rich Ives

Actually you can take a small lead as soon as the pitcher releases the pitch.

I think it's appropriate to assume that is what was meant in the OP.

[Tru_in_Blu]

PLAY 1-29

With R1 on 1B, B2 hits a ground ball to F4 who attempts to tag R1 retreating toward 1B. The ball is thrown to 1B to retire B2 and then R1 is tagged while on 1B.

R1 is safe. R1 is free to return to 1B after B2 is retired and the force out is removed. (1-FORCE OUT)

[Cecil4]

You are probably right about the lead, but given the OP's lack of softball experience, it could have been explained instead of dictated.

OP -
(1) in FP softball, the runner may not leave the base until the pitcher releases the pitch. Violating that causes a dead ball and "no pitch".
(2) For the intended rule question's sake, I'll ignore the "small lead".
Your question is about there being a force or not.
No, once the batter-runner is out there can be no force on other runners.

[Cecil4]

I'm out of practice on wording posts, so please critique.

[Tru_in_Blu]

Originally Posted by Cecil4

I'm out of practice on wording posts, so please critique.

It's like riding a bicycle, Cecil.

[ilyazhito]

There cannot be a force once the batter is out. The reason a force exists on a runner on first base is because two runners cannot occupy the same base, the batter must go to 1st base, and thus the runner on 1st must vacate her base for the batter. Once the batter is out, the conditions that triggered the force do not exist, so the runner going from 1st to 2nd must be tagged out.