Recovering from Football season

[bigjohn]

Sorry, thought you would find this.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=y...ure%3Dyoutu.be

[asdf]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

Sorry, thought you would find this.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=y...ure%3Dyoutu.be

And you still have not proven anything with regards to what the officials observed or what the medical staff observed.

[Terror]

I don't understand what you expect from the officials here. He is down, the officials signal time out and call for medical staff. They don't know why he is down as players lay down injured all the time. The med staff comes and the officials leave the area to dead ball officiate. The med staff probably should have known and done something, that seems obvious after the fact.

The rule for the officials is not really for this situation when medical staff come on the scene. Its for what an official would observe from a player who is still in the game but giving off concussion signals that he didn't need treatment for at the time of the hit. The rule says that if he is directed out of the game then he can't come back. But an official needs to do that and you do that with a player you observe with the symptoms. We trust that the medical staff is going to be better prepared than we are to make judgements when they come on the scene. If I see a rb staggering around or out of it after a play that he got his bell rung but on his way back to the huddle then it is on me to look at him and make a judgement, but when a player is down on the ground it is up to the med staff to do the same.

[bigjohn]

If this rule is to have any effect, the officials needs to find out what is wrong with this player that is being removed after laying on the ground for 5 minutes, if it is head related at all he needs to say to the head coach, He is done for the day.

That is the referees responsibility is to make sure a kid does not return to play after a head injury.
The coach and the trainers are definitely wrong to put a kid back in after being removed.

The official still is charged with enforcement of this rule if a coach breaks it.

That is very clearly the spirit of this rule and law. You guys can act like it is not his job to go find out why the kid was down. The Law says he needs to know and make sure no athlete is put in danger of serious injury.

[Welpe]

I'm glad I don't officiate in Ohio (at least for this reason).

[scrounge]

Originally Posted by Welpe

I'm glad I don't officiate in Ohio (at least for this reason).

No need to be, bigjohn is completely wrong on the officials' responsibilities and the implementation of this. The idea that the referee has a responsibility to intervene and ensure that others are following the law is contrary to anything in the statute or the training and implementation of this. Bigjohn, you are completely wrong on both the spirit and letter of the law.

[bigjohn]

4. What is the role of contest officials in administering the rule?
• Officials are to review and know the signs and symptoms of concussion and to direct
immediate removal of any student who displays these signs or symptoms. When informing the
head coach about removal of an athlete, the official shall be accompanied by another (second)
official if possible.
• An official shall not permit the athlete who has been removed under this rule to return to
competition that same day.
• If a contest official is aware that a student has been permitted to return to competition on the
same day as removal, that official shall immediately stop play and remove that student from
competition and report the incident to the OHSAA.


http://www.ohsaa.org/medicine/Concus...egulations.pdf

[asdf]

Did you get non-renewed in January because you don't know how to tell the truth?

Lie #1

Originally Posted by bigjohn

if it is head related at all he needs to say to the head coach, He is done for the day.

If this were true, a cut on the forehead would preclude a player from returning. How about a cut lip? Then you have the issue of the return to play protocol. A cut lip or forehead are not signs, symptoms or behaviors of a concussion.

Lie #2

Originally Posted by bigjohn

You guys can act like it is not his job to go find out why the kid was down. The Law says he needs to know and make sure no athlete is put in danger of serious injury.

Ok Mr. Cut and Paste.....Show me in the ORC or the OHSAA regulations where this is the case.

[bigjohn]

everyone on our staff was non renewed in January. The Head Coach was not rehired.

I did not apply to be employed as a football coach this year, my son was on the staff as a volunteer assistant. I am going to retire from teaching June 1, 2014



Not sure when you say Lie what you mean. The way I read these rules everyone is responsible for this new law.

[scrounge]

You can keep posting snippets out of context all you want, but all those apply to what the officials observe themselves in their normal course of duty. NOWHERE is an additional verification step or intervening with the judgment and actions of others implied, required, or even encouraged. Everyone is not responsible for everyone else, you have misread it. Everyone is responsible for what they observe and what they see, that's it.

[asdf]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

Not sure when you say Lie what you mean. The way I read these rules everyone is responsible for this new law.

You've been told countless times from people in the know that you are wrong, yet you continue to claim a law was broken, the officials knew the player was concussed, (because you "knew") that any injury in the head area causes a player to be removed, and the officials are supposed to stick their head in a group of medical professionals tending to an injured player.

You are either lying or just stupid.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

If this rule is to have any effect, the officials needs to find out what is wrong with this player that is being removed after laying on the ground for 5 minutes, if it is head related at all he needs to say to the head coach, He is done for the day.

That is the referees responsibility is to make sure a kid does not return to play after a head injury.
The coach and the trainers are definitely wrong to put a kid back in after being removed.

The official still is charged with enforcement of this rule if a coach breaks it.

That is very clearly the spirit of this rule and law. You guys can act like it is not his job to go find out why the kid was down. The Law says he needs to know and make sure no athlete is put in danger of serious injury.

If the rule is to do anything but chase officials out of the business, they need to not force officials to get involved in medical issues. Any law that tells officials to interject into situations where they are quite possibly the least qualified adults on the field needs to be repealed; and those who passed it flogged for stupidity.

[bisonlj]

The first year the NFHS rule was in place we had a player injured on an interception return. He was hit hard and apparently knocked out when his head hit the turf (the hit was legal). We called the medical staff out right away. This wasn't a situation where we saw a guy staggering and sent him out, but we could tell the likely injury was a concussion.

I don't think I would consider that in this case just seeing him on the ground because I can't see anything on the video that shows he obviously took a hit to the head. If I saw him get up and walk off like he did though, I would likely ask if the injury was a possible concussion. If the answer is yes then I would use our local procedure (no re-admission without clearance from a medical personnel and reporting to the state).

Does the crew NEED to be this diligent? No. Should they? I think they should.

[bigjohn]

I did not say they knew he was concussed. I said it was obvious he was showing signs or symptoms of a head injury/concussion. That is all that is needed for this rule to kick in. It doesn't matter who took him out of the game, it is the Referees job to stop play and remove him if he allowed back in the game.

That is what the DOD has said in official memos!
http://www.ohsaa.org/members/Memos/2013-08-30.pdf

3. Concussion:**When*a*player*has*signs*or*symptoms*o f*a*concussion*he*is*suspended*
from*the*game*and*may*not*reenter*the*game.**This* is*based*upon*Ohio*House*Bill*143.**
If*an*Ohio*Team*plays*a*game*in*another*state,*thi s*Rule*applies.**If*an*out*of*state*team*
plays*a*game*in*Ohio,*this*Rule*applies.**This*is* because*it*is*a*state*law*now