Fed 7-5 "additional" yards

[Robert Goodman]

In case of intentional PI, is the "penalized an additional 15 yards" added to the distance of a single penalty, i.e. made a 30 yd. penalty? Or is it administered as 2 penalties, each of 15 yds., in succession?

[HLin NC]

Keep reading on down to PENALTY after 7-5-13, note S27.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by HLin NC

Keep reading on down to PENALTY after 7-5-13, note S27.

That's where I got this from. It raises the question, doesn't answer it.

[HLin NC]

What does it really matter ? 30 = 15 + 15 = 30.

You stand a better chance of being struck by lightning inside your house than ever seeing it on the field.

There is no mechanic which specifies but since S27 is for USC/Non contact foul one can infer that the R would signal PI, U walk off 15, then signal USC and walk off 15.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by HLin NC

What does it really matter ? 30 = 15 + 15 = 30.

You stand a better chance of being struck by lightning inside your house than ever seeing it on the field.

There is no mechanic which specifies but since S27 is for USC/Non contact foul one can infer that the R would signal PI, U walk off 15, then signal USC and walk off 15.

It makes a difference if either is half the distance to the goal line. Then if it's a single 30 yard penalty it could be a much shorter distance than if it's 2 penalties nominally 15 yds. each.

[HLin NC]

Half the distance is half the distance no matter how you break down the math. No different scenario than if you had a live ball foul followed by a dead ball foul on the same team, ie DPI + USC.

[CT1]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

That's where I got this from. It raises the question, doesn't answer it.

Are you being intentionally obtuse?

Football Fundamentals state that all penalties are 5, 10 or 15 yards -- there is no 30 yard penalty.

So, the term "in addition" must mean that the team is penalized 15 yards for the PI, and 15 yards for the intent.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by CT1

Are you being intentionally obtuse?

Football Fundamentals state that all penalties are 5, 10 or 15 yards -- there is no 30 yard penalty.

So, the term "in addition" must mean that the team is penalized 15 yards for the PI, and 15 yards for the intent.

"Football Fundamentals" are after-the-fact summations that I don't trust. They're not fundamentals that the rules committee decides on first and then derives details from, and they're also not authoritative statements like approved rulings or interpretations books from the same source. Besides, 2-16-1 says, "A foul is a rules infraction for which a penalty is prescribed." A penalty, not 2 of them.

If Fed wanted to be clear, they would've said either that it's a 30 yard penalty in the case of intentional PI, or that it's successive 2 penalties of 15 yds. each, the second being a succeeding spot enforcement, rather than writing this "additional 15 yards" business. It's not clear whether "additional" means you add the yards to a single penalty or administer a 2nd penalty.

[CT1]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

Besides, 2-16-1 says, "A foul is a rules infraction for which a penalty is prescribed." A penalty, not 2 of them.

Then how can we eject a player for a flagrant foul? That's 15 yards plus ejection -- 2 penalties for the one foul.

It's not clear whether "additional" means you add the yards to a single penalty or administer a 2nd penalty.

It is to those of us who actually officiate.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

It's not clear whether "additional" means you add the yards to a single penalty or administer a 2nd penalty.

Well, it is to everyone but you.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by ct1

are you being intentionally obtuse?

always!

[bigjohn]

PENALTY: Illegal forward pass (Arts. 2a,b,c) – (S35); intentional grounding
(Arts. 2d,e) –(S36) – 5 yards plus loss of down – (S9). Pass interference (Art.
10) – (S33) – 15 yards and automatic first down if by B, 15 yards plus loss of
down if by A – (S9). If the pass interference by either player is intentional, his
team shall be penalized an additional 15 yards (S27). Ineligible downfield
(Art. 12) – (S37) – 5 yards. Illegal touching (Art. 13) – (S16) – 5 yards plus loss
of down.


I have seen an A players commit OPI intentionally to prevent an interception. No one even thinks about that being an additional 15 yard PENALTY!

[jchamp]

We had a case last year where a B player hit the QB late for RTP, then got a taunting USC as the intercepted pass was being returned for a soon-to-be nullified touchdown. (Goose-stepping with the ball held out to the pursuing A players as he crossed the goal line.)
We took 6 off the board, walked off two separate 15's, set the stakes and kept playing. The only thing more eerie than the chorus of boos and angry shouts from the visitor stands was the momentary silence when everyone looked at our WH when he began the signals. I felt really vulnerable holding a down indicator with no kevlar under my shirt.