"All But One" .....official left .....what wii you do ?

[James Neil]

Dec.15, 2002, Maryland Youth Football League Championship
The Marys, (235-0) coached by Pa Joe P jr. are playing The Lands (234-1) coached by Mr James Nayzium

Officials (attending by special invitations)
Referee: Mr. ABoselle
Umpire: Mr. James Neil
Head Linesman: Mr. The Ref of Oz!!!

4 minutes into the first of the three 5 minute periods (Using Maryland youth football rules games last no longer then 25 minutes)
The Lands have the ball 4/10 @ K-40 , K2 punts a high short kick that lands mid field , While the balls in the air K52 blocks R75 in the back @ K-45 . Before the ball's been touched by any R player, K9 muffs the ball @ R-48 where it then rolls to the R-15, R32 recovers and advances to the R-25. During R32’s runback R4 holds K15 @ R-35.

Seconds after Mr. ABoselle tossed his flag for K52’s block in the back he slips in the mid-field mud puddle and busts his noggin on a sprinkler head and is out for the duration. Mr. Neil runs smack into Mr. Nayzium who is on the field yelling about the holding by R4 and he is also incapacitated for the remainder of the game. Mr. The Ref of Oz!!! knows the right thing to do is step in, give the options and cover for his crew mates. He contemplates asking the game announcer , a certain well respected Fanofficial Mr. Derock to join him and finish the game but thinks better of it when he see Mr. Derock engaged in fisticuffs with an irate mother who want to know why he's not in there with these clowns who haven’t called tripping on her Little Johnny Runningback in any game he’s played all year . So Mr. TRoO!!! goes it alone and gives these options ………………8^)

[ABoselli]

I'm immortalized forever! ( just like Mr. Bojangles, only without a cool song )

They don't run the option in that league, as defenses have wised up and just tackle everybody without the ball right after the snap. That makes identifying the ball carrier a lot easier.

I laughed out loud - good job.

[Derock1986]

Originally posted by James Neil
Dec.15, 2002, Maryland Youth Football League Championship
The Marys, (235-0) coached by Pa Joe P jr. are playing The Lands (234-1) coached by Mr James Nayzium

Officials (attending by special invitations)
Referee: Mr. ABoselle
Umpire: Mr. James Neil
Head Linesman: Mr. The Ref of Oz!!!

4 minutes into the first of the three 5 minute periods (Using Maryland youth football rules games last no longer then 25 minutes)
The Lands have the ball 4/10 @ K-40 , K2 punts a high short kick that lands mid field , While the balls in the air K52 blocks R75 in the back @ K-45 . Before the ball's been touched by any R player, K9 muffs the ball @ R-48 where it then rolls to the R-15, R32 recovers and advances to the R-25. During R32’s runback R4 holds K15 @ R-35.

Seconds after Mr. ABoselle tossed his flag for K52’s block in the back he slips in the mid-field mud puddle and busts his noggin on a sprinkler head and is out for the duration. Mr. Neil runs smack into Mr. Nayzium who is on the field yelling about the holding by R4 and he is also incapacitated for the remainder of the game. Mr. The Ref of Oz!!! knows the right thing to do is step in, give the options and cover for his crew mates. He contemplates asking the game announcer , a certain well respected Fanofficial Mr. Derock to join him and finish the game but thinks better of it when he see Mr. Derock engaged in fisticuffs with an irate mother who want to know why he's not in there with these clowns who haven’t called tripping on her Little Johnny Runningback in any game he’s played all year . So Mr. TRoO!!! goes it alone and gives these options ………………8^)

With Mr Neil and Aboselli flat on their faces (bums), the coaches, players, and parents close in on Oz to confront him about the options. Oz puts up a valiant fight but is no match for the coaches AND parents who have taken the field. One coach shoves Oz while another took his whistle. Then a kid starts to urinate on Oz's shoes while 2 parents screamed insults at him. Oz, "all but one" second from being mauled by this angry out of control mob, reaches for his flag and tosses it straight up in the air as hard as he could. When the flag reached its highest point, it exploded with a call for help message in stars that read, "Derock, save us!" Meanwhile, Derock sat in the stand laughing as he watched this all unfold. After getting one parent straight in the stands, Derock realizes that he must step forward and save these 3 officials who presumed youth games would be a breeze compared to the high school varsity cracker jack championship. Derock stands and leaps from the sideline to the middle of the field in ONE JUMP and lands directly over Oz. At that instant the angry crowd recognized Derock and immediately began to retreat back to the sideline in fear of a 15 yard penalty or even worst--EJECTION! After single-handedly clearing the field, Derock then turned his attention on the other fallen officials. He first awakened Aboselli and told Aboselli, "get some shoes with better traction OR just stay out of the middle of the field where the mud puddle is--common sense (game sense) I would think." Derock then walks up to Mr Neil, who is still lying on the ground, and kicks him in the rear end. Mr Neil jumps up and says why did you do that? Derock says, "because I knew you had to be faking--what are the chances of TWO officials getting knocked out in the same youth game?" "Had you told Mr Nayzium to stay off the field, you would have never ran into him to begin with." Finally, Derock approaches Oz and hands him his white hat, solid gold whistle, and diamond studded flag and says to him "Oz, you call this game. You're not afraid to be the leader (unlike Mr Neil who faked being incapacitated in fear of having to take the white hat) AND you have better judgement (knows when to call for help and won't run through mud puddles).

[James Neil]

Oh brother, give me a break . I was hoping that with a little levity I could ease Oz into working the enforcement on this play. I really wasn’t expecting any more of your crap. I’m not amused by any of your post. Just more of your chipped shoulder immature prattle.
I know I’m going to be sorry for this, but tell us old great one. Since as you say you know penalty enforcement, what are the options you would give concerning the fouls on this play?

4/10 @ K-40 , K2 punts a high short kick that lands mid field , While the balls in the air K52 blocks R75 in the back @ K-45 . Before the ball's been touched by any R player, K9 muffs the ball @ R-48 where it then rolls to the R-15, R32 recovers and advances to the R-25. During R32’s runback R4 holds K15 @ R-35.

[Derock1986]

Originally posted by James Neil
Oh brother, give me a break . I was hoping that with a little levity I could ease Oz into working the enforcement on this play. I really wasn’t expecting any more of your crap. I’m not amused by any of your post. Just more of your chipped shoulder immature prattle.
I know I’m going to be sorry for this, but tell us old great one. Since as you say you know penalty enforcement, what are the options you would give concerning the fouls on this play?

4/10 @ K-40 , K2 punts a high short kick that lands mid field , While the balls in the air K52 blocks R75 in the back @ K-45 . Before the ball's been touched by any R player, K9 muffs the ball @ R-48 where it then rolls to the R-15, R32 recovers and advances to the R-25. During R32’s runback R4 holds K15 @ R-35.

Here's "my" call.
We have an illegal touching by K9 and holding on R4.
THE PENALTIES OFFSET--REPLAY THE DOWN!

[Derock1986]

Originally posted by James Neil
Oh brother, give me a break . I was hoping that with a little levity I could ease Oz into working the enforcement on this play. I really wasn’t expecting any more of your crap. I’m not amused by any of your post. Just more of your chipped shoulder immature prattle.
I know I’m going to be sorry for this, but tell us old great one. Since as you say you know penalty enforcement, what are the options you would give concerning the fouls on this play?

4/10 @ K-40 , K2 punts a high short kick that lands mid field , While the balls in the air K52 blocks R75 in the back @ K-45 . Before the ball's been touched by any R player, K9 muffs the ball @ R-48 where it then rolls to the R-15, R32 recovers and advances to the R-25. During R32’s runback R4 holds K15 @ R-35.

Mr Neil,
If you don't want to deal with "my crap", then leave me out of your posts. You started 2 posts directed towards me. Am I your hero or something? If you want the big dog to stay in the house, STOP jerking his chain!!!!

In the goodness of the holiday spirit and for the love of officiating,
HAPPY HOLIDAYS Mr Neil!

[Edited by Derock1986 on Dec 25th, 2002 at 09:12 AM]

[James Neil]

4/10 @ K-40 ,
[/B][/QUOTE]

Here's "my" call.
We have an illegal touching by K9 and holding on R4.
THE PENALTIES OFFSET--REPLAY THE DOWN! [/B][/QUOTE]

WRONG! You’re not even close. But this doesn’t surprise one iota .You have the game sense and rules knowledge of a rock. But hey, you’ve been doing it wrong for so long, why change now, right? And yes you are my hero. I really wish I could lie as well as you do. No wait, you don’t lie very well at all come to think of it. As far as the ONE thread I started directed toward you, excuse me. It was my sincere attempt to help you get a rule book. Your refusal to accept this offer doesn’t surprise me either... I will no longer use your name or direct any further postings toward you . Please do the same for me . Now please go to a fan board where you belong and leave officiating to those who care about getting it right.
.Happy holidays Derock

[Derock1986]

Originally posted by James Neil

4/10 @ K-40 ,

Here's "my" call.
We have an illegal touching by K9 and holding on R4.
THE PENALTIES OFFSET--REPLAY THE DOWN! [/B][/QUOTE]

WRONG! You’re not even close. But this doesn’t surprise one iota .You have the game sense and rules knowledge of a rock. But hey, you’ve been doing it wrong for so long, why change now, right? [/B][/QUOTE]

Exactly Mr Neil! Consistency--you're learning after all! Now all you need is some guts and a heart to take the leadership role on the field and you will be well on your way! I might even let you wipe the dirt off my shoes after some of my games.

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by Derock1986
Here's "my" call.
We have an illegal touching by K9 and holding on R4.
THE PENALTIES OFFSET--REPLAY THE DOWN!

Wherethehell did you get illegal touching from?

[Theisey]

I was about to ask the same question.

Yes, there was some touching by the kicking team, but under NF rules it is called first touching (and NCAA rules it is called illegal touching) but in BOTH rules, this is not a foul.
Care to take another stab at this?

[ABoselli]

Let me take a stab -

The first touching is canceled because there's going to be an accepted foul here somewhere. R got the ball with clean hands, so they can keep it as long as the penalty for the hold is enforced from the R35. K has no options in this case. If R does want to accept the penalty on K's foul, we would have offsetting and a rekick.

If there's a double foul on a change of possession play, the team in possession at the end of the down can keep the ball as long as their foul was not prior to the (last) change of possession (clean hands) and their penalty is marked off. The other team has no options. I know its somewhere in the case book.

Do I pass?

PS - I haven't missed a Sunday in about three years. I've done yutes every year and continue to do them. I let a lot more go in those games (kids can't line up right, wiggle around in their stance, turn upfield early when they're in motion etc.) and concentrate on saftey, learning and fairness. When I'm doing varsity games where people's jobs are lost, I let a lot less go and make sure I know what the enforcements are.

[Edited by ABoselli on Dec 25th, 2002 at 07:26 PM]

[JimNayzium]

First of all, merry christmas everyone....if Rock came to me with illegal touching i would go bOOOLiztick....ask him for his gamesense to explain why my kid trying to down a punt would be illegal, and if this were to really happen, my only last dying wish as i faded quickly after getting trucked by Mr. Neil would be that the white hat, after explaining his ruling, whatever it may be, would ask as he put his hand on his back pocket, "would you like me to show it to you?" and as I a faded away into the afterlife, i would die satisfied that the last time i got screwed in a game it was by a guy who had his rulebook on him....hahaha....

But praise the Lord that i did not get run into by ROck as he works out you know....
great post NEIL

[James Neil]

Good job AB, I’m glad to see you’ve recovered enough to get back into the game. We all know you can’t keep a good man down. Great expiation of the clean hands principal and the cancellation of R's right to first touching...(I got a feeling someone we know is saying "that’s too confusing for my game sense and makes my head hurt so I aint going to do it" 8^(
I’m sure you know you’re not done yet though. I guess you wanted to get the live ball enforcements out of the way before you take care of anything else we have here in this play , right? …..hint, hint …..Coach Nayzium is going to wait next time for that holding flag he wants sooooo bad LOL 8^) and be careful with the trucking jokes Coach, I carry two flags and if I’ve regained consciousness and hear this you might be gone for good! 8^)

Oh ya AB …don’t forget to explain about setting the chains

[Derock1986]

Originally posted by James Neil
be careful with the trucking jokes Coach, I carry two flags and if I’ve regained consciousness and hear this you might be gone for good! 8^)

Oh ya AB …don’t forget to explain about setting the chains

You carry TWO flags? I hope you're joking. First sign of an official who intends to throw a lot of flags is when you see TWO flags! You don't need 2 flags Mr Neil (aka textbook flag happy official--Barney Fyfe with not one but two guns!).

Mr Nayzium do you really want this guy calling your game?? He may know the rules but a combination of being a stickler for the rules and 2 flags can be disasterous. Unless Mr Neil is calling the game one-sided, you too Mr Nayzium will feel the effects of Mr Neil. I would think you would much rather see the 2 teams play than after every play see if Mr Neil has thrown yet another flag or even BOTH flags! As a coach, I would rather let the 2 teams decide the outcome with as little influence by the officials as possible. If you see an official calling a game with 2 flags and a rule book in his pocket, that official is going to disrupt the flow of the game by over asserting himself. One flag is enough and leave your rule book at home.

I may emphasize game sense a lot but I let 'em play and the games are enjoyable. I make sensible calls and stay away from calls that require on the field rule book explanations.

[DrMooreReferee]

This is interesting. I can't believe this, but I'm actually going to have to agree with Derock on one thing, sorta. I would never take a rulebook out on the field with me for a game. However, I don't think Mr.Neil ever said that he would either. In my opinion, it makes you look real bad to take a rulebook out on the game field with ya.

Now, as for the 2 flags. I've worked with a bunch of officials that carry 2 flags. I only carry one flag myself. But its a personal preference issue. Its kinda like the issue of using a finger whistle or lanyard type. There are times when having 2 flags can be useful.

Derock, seriously, I'm not taking aim on you. But it really does seem like you need to spend some more time in the rulebook and casebook. Nobody is saying that game sense isn't important. But knowledge of the rules is IMPERATIVE. You must have the knowledge of the rules in order to properly officiate the game. In other words. Having air in your tires is an important thing when going on a trip, however, if your gas tank is empty it ain't gonna matter if your tires are properly inflated or not.

Take some time to study that rulebook at every opportunity you have. And then come back and battle these guys if you like. But until then, they will continue to carve you up like a christmas turkey if you don't know the rules.


The Doctor