no captain on field/penalty declined automatically?

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

The tradition/practice is to consult captains when there's an actual decision to be made. In the play in the OP, there is no real decision. Enforce the penalty and move on.

Good officials know when to save a few seconds and also know when to take a few extra seconds.

I understand that what "good officials" due in one part of the Country may not be exactly the same in other parts of the Country, so if you consider yourself a "good official" do what you think is right, and you should be just fine.

However, if you want get picky, the Officials Manual (5 Officials-Administering Penalties-Referee, Page 50) suggests;

4. Give options to Captain of offended team.
5. When Captain's most advantageous choice is obvious, quickly inform him.
6. When Captain does not respond, his silence shall be considered acceptance of obvious choice...

Sometimes it just boils down to whose best interests you're concerned about serving, and what is considered "standard" for your area.

[footballref]

Originally Posted by ajmc

I understand that what "good officials" due in one part of the Country may not be exactly the same in other parts of the Country, so if you consider yourself a "good official" do what you think is right, and you should be just fine.

However, if you want get picky, the Officials Manual (5 Officials-Administering Penalties-Referee, Page 50) suggests;

4. Give options to Captain of offended team.
5. When Captain's most advantageous choice is obvious, quickly inform him.
6. When Captain does not respond, his silence shall be considered acceptance of obvious choice...

Sometimes it just boils down to whose best interests you're concerned about serving, and what is considered "standard" for your area.

So you have quoted lots of things telling us that we need to consult captains and give them respect.

I have yet to see anything where a penalty is automatically declined if a captain is not on the field.

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by footballref

So you have quoted lots of things telling us that we need to consult captains and give them respect.

I have yet to see anything where a penalty is automatically declined if a captain is not on the field.

I wasn't "telling you" anything, I merely suggested that there are a number of good reasons for discussing such matters with Captains. More than likely the area you work in has a standard, and you're likely best off adjusting to and following that standard.

I never suggested, nor do I believe there is any situation for automatically declining a penalty because the Captain is not on the field, although there are a number of situations where declining may be the very obvious choice. In those situations I've always spent those extra few seconds telling the Captain what was going on, suggesting the obvious choice and getting his concurrence. That sequence has yet to cause me any problem.

I just think if a Captain has earned an added level of respect, it's smart to give it to him. It's very possible we might need an added level of respect somewhat later from that same Captain.

[bkdow]

my rule book does not mention an automatic decline if a captain is not on the field. Sounds like an over-reaching, agitated official if the facts are correct. I've seen my share both as a player and a fellow official.

[AHSAA_Ref]

Nvm, bigmo! Good luck this week. My dad's association will be your officials this week! You've got the best they have to offer coming your way!

[BIG UMP]

No one needs to get bent out of shape here. Read the original post, "my team", is the statement that gets my attention. He really doesn't know what happened it just happened to his team.

He joined Nov 2010 and has posted twice, I would guess twice that officials messed up his team's game.

[footballref]

Originally Posted by ajmc

I wasn't "telling you" anything, I merely suggested that there are a number of good reasons for discussing such matters with Captains. More than likely the area you work in has a standard, and you're likely best off adjusting to and following that standard.

I never suggested, nor do I believe there is any situation for automatically declining a penalty because the Captain is not on the field, although there are a number of situations where declining may be the very obvious choice. In those situations I've always spent those extra few seconds telling the Captain what was going on, suggesting the obvious choice and getting his concurrence. That sequence has yet to cause me any problem.

I just think if a Captain has earned an added level of respect, it's smart to give it to him. It's very possible we might need an added level of respect somewhat later from that same Captain.

I agree totally that this could have been a situation where declining was the better decision. That decision was made without consulting a captain.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by footballref

I have yet to see anything where a penalty is automatically declined if a captain is not on the field.

That's because there is no such thing. Either coach was lying, or was lied to, or somewhere in between.

[cmathews]

Originally Posted by ajmc

I understand that what "good officials" due in one part of the Country may not be exactly the same in other parts of the Country, so if you consider yourself a "good official" do what you think is right, and you should be just fine.

However, if you want get picky, the Officials Manual (5 Officials-Administering Penalties-Referee, Page 50) suggests;

4. Give options to Captain of offended team.
5. When Captain's most advantageous choice is obvious, quickly inform him.
6. When Captain does not respond, his silence shall be considered acceptance of obvious choice...

Sometimes it just boils down to whose best interests you're concerned about serving, and what is considered "standard" for your area.

it appears to me that the lack of a captain on the field would also be considered a non response by the captain, there fore an acceptance, certainly not an automatic declination