Bizarre ending should actually have been touchback, right?

[rockchalk jhawk]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

well the article in the OP definitely names names.

it names the name of the alert player who scooped it up and ran it for a touchdown (kudos for him, he deserves to be named), not the name of the player who goofed by spiking the ball.

you really are a troll, aren't you?

[bigjohn]

The kick was about five yards short and was fielded in the end zone by an Otter Valley player who ran it out to his 11, where he spiked the ball and began celebrating.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

The kick was about five yards short and was fielded in the end zone by an Otter Valley player who ran it out to his 11, where he spiked the ball and began celebrating.

Says who? As I see it, the kick was 12-15 yards short and fielded around the 3 yard line.

[JRutledge]

Either way, the ball was not blown dead (which is a judgment of the officials) and the player threw the ball down backwards as he approached near the 10 yard line. This is not an illegal pass; this is a backward pass which would make the play still live. The video was really hard to tell where the lines were. But the officials did not stop officiating and ruled this a TD.

I guess the Referee should have had a conversation with the two officials that were standing right there and everything would have been resolved.

Peace

[NorCalRef12]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Says who? As I see it, the kick was 12-15 yards short and fielded around the 3 yard line.

I think you're looking at the picture that was posted incorrectly. The picture from earlier in the post shows three pylons, the one all the way on the left is in line with the inbounds marks, the center pylon is at the back corner, and the goal line pylon is all the way on the right.

That picture, plus the REPORT that it was caught 5 yards deep seems is proof enough for me that the crew booted the call. The BJ should have been able to see an R player catching the ball in the EZ.

Since it is clear the receiver did not have 15' arms it should have been easy to rule this as being in the EZ.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by NorCalRef12

I think you're looking at the picture that was posted incorrectly. The picture from earlier in the post shows three pylons, the one all the way on the left is in line with the inbounds marks, the center pylon is at the back corner, and the goal line pylon is all the way on the right.

That picture, plus the REPORT that it was caught 5 yards deep seems is proof enough for me that the crew booted the call. The BJ should have been able to see an R player catching the ball in the EZ.

Since it is clear the receiver did not have 15' arms it should have been easy to rule this as being in the EZ.

I'm a basketball guy, but I watched the video and I would dispute the report that it was fielded 5 yards deep. I don't typically trust reporters with those types of details, though.
If it was in the endzone, it was close.

[Patton]

Originally Posted by NorCalRef12

I think you're looking at the picture that was posted incorrectly. The picture from earlier in the post shows three pylons, the one all the way on the left is in line with the inbounds marks, the center pylon is at the back corner, and the goal line pylon is all the way on the right.

That picture, plus the REPORT that it was caught 5 yards deep seems is proof enough for me that the crew booted the call. The BJ should have been able to see an R player catching the ball in the EZ.

Since it is clear the receiver did not have 15' arms it should have been easy to rule this as being in the EZ.

NorCal...Don't be so quick to throw these guys under the bus. You should know that reporters frequently "get it wrong".

Take another look at the video and take notice of the shadows on the field. In particular, notice where the officials signal the TD (assuming they're on the GL) and where the receiver fields the ball. I believe he is very close to the GL and probably at the 1-2 yd line. I also agree with others that he throws a backwards pass, not an IFP.

This would have been an extremely difficult play to officiate and virtually impossible to have everyone in a perfect vantage point to rule on everything. That said, I think they got it right. The reporter definetely didn't.

[chymechowder]

question from a HS official in Mass., where a scrimmage kick needs to touch the GROUND on or behind Team B's goal line for it to be a dead ball. (and not having been touched by Team B before hitting the ground.)

you're talking about the field goal attempt becoming dead by rule once it crosses the goal line. is that a special rule just for FG attempts? or does it apply to all srimmage kicks?

(It would seem odd to me that there can be no returns of punts fielded in the endzone). thanks

[Welpe]

chyme, it applies to ALL legal kicks, both scrimmage and free kicks. As soon as the kick breaks the plane of the goal line, the ball is dead and it is a touchback for B.

[whitehat]

Originally Posted by chymechowder

question from a HS official in Mass., where a scrimmage kick needs to touch the GROUND on or behind Team B's goal line for it to be a dead ball. (and not having been touched by Team B before hitting the ground.)

you're talking about the field goal attempt becoming dead by rule once it crosses the goal line. is that a special rule just for FG attempts? or does it apply to all srimmage kicks?

(It would seem odd to me that there can be no returns of punts fielded in the endzone). thanks

If I'm not mistaken Mass and Texas use NCAA rules for football. I am sure Texas does. The rule is different for NF than for NCAA. NF as soon as the ball breaks the plane of the goal line on all kicks entereing R's EZ it is dead.

[NorCalRef12]

Originally Posted by Patton

NorCal...Don't be so quick to throw these guys under the bus. You should know that reporters frequently "get it wrong".

We're on a forum with anonymous screen names, I thought we were supposed to throw people under the bus! If we can't do it here then where can we do it?

In all seriousness though, I looked at where it was caught, right near the end of the shadows, then I looked where the ref was when he signalled TD, also seemed to be in line with the end of the shadows.

So yes, I'm probably guilty of believing the news report that it was kicked 5 yards deep into the EZ. But then again, I'm 3500 miles away and I trust everything that they say on the news!

[JugglingReferee]

Local news coverage.


Video - WCAX.COM Local Vermont News, Weather and Sports-

[l3will]

So what mechanics does your crew use to make sure this doesn't happen to you???

Just mentioning this because I can imagine that most crews would not have anyone on
the goal line or anyone who can get there quickly.

When it is apparent that the kick is going to be short, does your BJ try to get to the goal line??

I can see where this could easily be blown if R was coming out of the endzone and
caught the ball close to the goal line.

[Canned Heat]

Maybe I'm seeing things, but if you pause it at the :19 mark, it looks as if he catches the scrimmage kick attempt at about the 2 or 3 yard line (I think I see goal line and 5 yard line on each side of the players...look at pylons, too) and advances to the 12 and then spikes it backwards...where it is picked up and returned for TD. Looks like a good call and score to me.

As for how we would handle that....In 5 man we would obviously have 2 men back under the posts for the FG attempt. When it was certain to be short by the BJ (or LJ) he would run up from the posts and make sure the ball did or did not cross the goal line (becoming dead) and either kill it or bag the spot and point the other way towards us so we knew we had a live ball situation. In 4 man (JV/FR) we would have LJ back and white hat catching the other post. LJ would run up to rule on ball crossing the GL and becoming dead or still live..as is what happened here. Good goal line reaction by BJ & LJ from the posts.

Also...is that an inadvertant whistle I hear right before the score..?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Canned Heat

Maybe I'm seeing things, but if you pause it at the :19 mark, it looks as if he catches the scrimmage kick attempt at about the 2 or 3 yard line (I think I see goal line and 5 yard line on each side of the players...look at pylons, too) and advances to the 12 and then spikes it backwards...where it is picked up and returned for TD. Looks like a good call and score to me.

As for how we would handle that....In 5 man we would obviously have 2 men back under the posts for the FG attempt. When it was certain to be short by the BJ (or LJ) he would run up from the posts and make sure the ball did or did not cross the goal line (becoming dead) and either kill it or bag the spot and point the other way towards us so we knew we had a live ball situation. In 4 man (JV/FR) we would have LJ back and white hat catching the other post. LJ would run up to rule on ball crossing the GL and becoming dead or still live..as is what happened here. I didn't notice...were there any covering officials at the posts for the FG?

Also...is that an inadvertant whistle I hear right before the score..?

In 4-man we put the LJ on the end line, but not under a post -- he has only the crossbar and gives the R a thinbs up or thumbs down. That way the wing can get to the open goal line pylon. The R calls both uprights (lining up behind the kick) and the L handles the roughing of the kicker and holder.