Hs Or Ncaa ?

[jjrye22]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Then assume that most posts are about NF Rules (which they clearly are) and if you are not completely sure, then ask (which most will gladly clarify). There is no need to give a life story and then tell people how to reference every post.

Peace

There is a big difference between asking people and telling people. And I agree with most everyone else that posted in this thread that it is OFTEN not clear which set of rules are being referenced (especially when people throw in NFL and adapted NFL rules). Then there is always a confusion with people asking for clarification, and others jumping in with 'I think he is talking about...'

I also want to say that the welcome that Rut extended is absolutely appalling and just makes you look like an arrogant dick.

James

[grantsrc]

Originally Posted by jjrye22

I also want to say that the welcome that Rut extended is absolutely appalling and just makes you look like an arrogant dick.

James

You expect anything less from him?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by jjrye22

There is a big difference between asking people and telling people. And I agree with most everyone else that posted in this thread that it is OFTEN not clear which set of rules are being referenced (especially when people throw in NFL and adapted NFL rules). Then there is always a confusion with people asking for clarification, and others jumping in with 'I think he is talking about...'

I also want to say that the welcome that Rut extended is absolutely appalling and just makes you look like an arrogant dick.

James

I always find it interesting that most of the people that are clueless about basic information on this discussion board are from other countries. I also find it interesting the people that always want to accuse people of things first start name calling. I just read about 3 or 4 posts this morning and almost all of them reference very specific rules in many answers that are given. All you have to do is read and you will get your answer as to what code applies and if you are unsure, you can ask and someone will gladly accommodate.

No one references NFL rules for a HS game that I have ever seen. And most conversations on rules never talk about NFL because most people here do not work under those rules. Of course we might compare rules sets, but that is when there are people that are confused of a rule or want to know the differences. Usually this is made extremely clear.

Most of the time people only reference rules for the level they are talking about in the post. For example if people are talking about college football (Florida/Auburn KCI reference for example), then the references are about NCAA and someone even might come up and say what the NF rule is or interpretation is. It is not like people come out of left field and do not reference those rules.

There was a link that I have seen posted many times on this website that talks about "Before you post....." This thread needs that link right now. If you want to lecture everyone about how they should post, I would hope you have been around for at least 2 months before you start telling everyone how to post. If saying that makes me arrogant and a dick, then so be it. I know that if he would have posted a similar topic on the basketball and baseball boards, he certainly would have had much more sarcasm and harsh comments.

It makes me wonder how guys like this can officiate if he gets this upset over a response on a discussion board and we are not face to face.

Peace

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by jjrye22

There is a big difference between asking people and telling people. And I agree with most everyone else that posted in this thread that it is OFTEN not clear which set of rules are being referenced (especially when people throw in NFL and adapted NFL rules). Then there is always a confusion with people asking for clarification, and others jumping in with 'I think he is talking about...'

And you'd think that when someone actually cites a rule number or quotes from a rule book, it wouldn't be too much trouble to add which book.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

No one references NFL rules for a HS game that I have ever seen.

No, but they often refer to a "game" and you don't know it's a HS game, let alone a HS game played under Fed rules. Frequently that's one's best bet, for instance if the game is said to have been played on a Fri. night. But around here, HS varsities play on Saturdays (not enough fields with lights, not many colleges have football with much following), and there are circuits of schools that don't belong to their state HSAA, and there are states whose HSAA doesn't use Fed for football, so you never know.

And most conversations on rules never talk about NFL because most people here do not work under those rules.

Not most, but maybe more than you think. Most adult nonacademic football is played under the current or previous season's NFL rules or a slight modification of them. In any given year in New York City, I think there are more games of football under such rules than under NCAA's.

USFA rules are catching on, I understand.

Robert

[Don Mueller]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I always find it interesting that most of the people that are clueless about basic information on this discussion board are from other countries.

It may be "interesting" to you but if true makes perfect sense. They have less exposure to the game. By coming to this board they are being proactive and making an effort to learn.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I also find it interesting the people that always want to accuse people of things first start name calling.

I don't think the name calling was an accusation, I think it was a statement of fact, at least relative to this thread.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

All you have to do is read

Rut, take your own advice, you're the one that didn't understand the simple request fronm the OP.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

If you want to lecture everyone about how they should post, I would hope you have been around for at least 2 months before you start telling everyone how to post.

The OP never made a demand nor told anyone how to post. It was a simple REQUEST. If you choose to ignore or feel the request is already being met so be it.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

If saying that makes me arrogant and a dick, then so be it. I know that if he would have posted a similar topic on the basketball and baseball boards, he certainly would have had much more sarcasm and harsh comments.

Do you treat all requests made of you with such harshness and sarcasm?

Originally Posted by JRutledge

It makes me wonder how guys like this can officiate if he gets this upset over a response on a discussion board and we are not face to face.

.

I didn't read "upset" in his comments. I read frustration over your inability to comprehend his request and a slight dismissal of your intolerance and arrogance.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

No, but they often refer to a "game" and you don't know it's a HS game, let alone a HS game played under Fed rules. Frequently that's one's best bet, for instance if the game is said to have been played on a Fri. night. But around here, HS varsities play on Saturdays (not enough fields with lights, not many colleges have football with much following), and there are circuits of schools that don't belong to their state HSAA, and there are states whose HSAA doesn't use Fed for football, so you never know.


Not most, but maybe more than you think. Most adult nonacademic football is played under the current or previous season's NFL rules or a slight modification of them. In any given year in New York City, I think there are more games of football under such rules than under NCAA's.

USFA rules are catching on, I understand.

Robert

Is there even a glimmer of a point here? I don't always get along with JR, but he'd dead on here. This is simple. If you have a question about a specific rule set, post it. if you don't know whether a certain answer is about a certain rule set, and it's not clear, ask. Most of the time it's FED, and yes - if someone says Friday night you can probably assume it was FED. If it wasn't, it's their responsibility to say so, or they will get a wrong answer from this group.

I don't understand what you're even arguing about.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

Is there even a glimmer of a point here? I don't always get along with JR, but he'd dead on here. This is simple. If you have a question about a specific rule set, post it. if you don't know whether a certain answer is about a certain rule set, and it's not clear, ask. Most of the time it's FED, and yes - if someone says Friday night you can probably assume it was FED. If it wasn't, it's their responsibility to say so, or they will get a wrong answer from this group.

I don't understand what you're even arguing about.

I think we're arguing about how often posters here fulfill that responsibility. Also, people don't come here just to ask questions, but also to learn from others' questions & answers. So even if the initial post and responses are all by people who know which rules they're discussing, they may be read, maybe as much as years later, by other people who don't.

This is not the only forum, nor the only subject, where I think participants should be reminded of that last fact. Too many online forums start out aspiring to universality, but tend to become clubby without anyone's intending them to be so, just because people start assuming knowledge on the part of the participants which tends to exclude strangers.

Robert

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

I think we're arguing about how often posters here fulfill that responsibility. Also, people don't come here just to ask questions, but also to learn from others' questions & answers. So even if the initial post and responses are all by people who know which rules they're discussing, they may be read, maybe as much as years later, by other people who don't.

This is not the only forum, nor the only subject, where I think participants should be reminded of that last fact. Too many online forums start out aspiring to universality, but tend to become clubby without anyone's intending them to be so, just because people start assuming knowledge on the part of the participants which tends to exclude strangers.

Robert

I guess my point is ... why are we arguing about how often posters fulfill that responsibility. You say 10%, JR says 90, I say 50. Who cares how common that is. The point has been made that we should do it. Move along. A couple more posts, and this horse will be deader than the Tim McClelland Slow Call post on the baseball board.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Don Mueller

It may be "interesting" to you but if true makes perfect sense. They have less exposure to the game. By coming to this board they are being proactive and making an effort to learn.

Don,

This was largely a sarcastic comment. If you read the basketball board, it might make more sense to you. It was kind of an inside joke.

Originally Posted by Don Mueller

I don't think the name calling was an accusation, I think it was a statement of fact, at least relative to this thread.

When you call someone a name because they tell the truth (because you can ask anyone for clarification on a rule and it is rare someone will not give you that information), that was a little more than an accusation. I guess you have to arrogant and a dick because you give an opinion.

Originally Posted by Don Mueller

Rut, take your own advice, you're the one that didn't understand the simple request fronm the OP.

I did not understand why someone needed to create an entire thread to tell people something they already did (do not be offended, that is a personal opinion). And when I saw the number of posts made by the person, and the time they were here. It was clear this person did not read very many posts (or pay attention) to what goes on here. It is very common people give all the rules information and is very helpful in doing so. I know I do not answer any question on this board without trying to clarify the rule we are talking about when requested. I will even say I do not know what the college rule is but here is the NF interpretation.

Originally Posted by Don Mueller

The OP never made a demand nor told anyone how to post. It was a simple REQUEST. If you choose to ignore or feel the request is already being met so be it.

Anytime you make a post, you open yourself up for what others think. This is the nature of the internet and discussion boards. I had every right to point out that he needed to stick around and realize that already takes place. He might not have been aware. Who knows? Also I personally do not care what he knows. This is a public forum. If he cannot handle responses than a person should never post on any internet site anywhere. I can tell you my response was very tame compared to many others with a similar theme. And the fact that he said he was from a different country might have had many harsh comments thrown his way under the right circumstances.

Originally Posted by Don Mueller

Do you treat all requests made of you with such harshness and sarcasm?

I do not consider what I said was harsh. But then again I was not raised in this insane world that requires every comment to apologize for telling you what we might think. If someone did not curse at me or call me an offensive name, I would not consider that harsh. If what I said was harsh, some of the people here would never be able to handle the teacher in a real estate class I am currently taking when he answers questions very direct and keeps everyone constantly laughing. I guess everyone does not have very think skin.

I could have said the guy was stupid and dump and all I said was that "we already do that here and if you had been around you might realize that." I heard much more harsh language at the football game I worked last night. And I did not see anyone getting upset with that use of language like a few are here right now.

Originally Posted by Don Mueller

I didn't read "upset" in his comments. I read frustration over your inability to comprehend his request and a slight dismissal of your intolerance and arrogance.

So are you saying that most people here are arrogant? I have been here for some time and most posters are people that have good hearts and want to learn. We might argue, but they are arguing for what they feel is right. I would not think that makes them arrogant because they might not be clear from time to time. The core group of people here has a lot of experience and they can be very helpful if you ASK THEM THE RIGHT QUESTIONS SO THEY CAN HELP YOU!!!

People answer questions mostly from their experience. I have been around this site for almost 10 years and I have been around a couple other officiating sites for around that same time (many people had to register on this site around 2000, so the date is not accurate as to when some of us first registered). So if someone works mostly NF rules, they are not going to be aware of all the NCAA rules and interpretations. And if you are from Texas, you might not be aware of all the all the NF rules and interpretations. And the average official knows most people work only NF rules. I have no idea what they do all over the world. I do know if you ask what rules you want an interpretation from, I do know how to answer or not answer the question.

Now you have called people arrogant because they did not answer the way you wanted them to. I have not called a single person a name who supported this guy or even took me on. I just see this as very ironic.

Peace