Illegal Undershirts Prior to Start of Game

[BryanV21]

Why cause a problem? Just let them change their shirts and delay the game a couple of minutes. I understand not wanting to hold the game up for it, but I don't see the big deal.

[Freddy]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

I don't see the big deal.

Originally Posted by BryanV21

Why cause a problem? Just let them change their shirts and delay the game a couple of minutes.

I'm sure the opposing coach who knows the rule wouldn't consider your suspending of a clear rule a "big deal", especially if you were doing it solely for personal convenience, not wanting to "cause a problem".

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Freddy

I'm sure the opposing coach who knows the rule wouldn't consider your suspending of a clear rule a "big deal", especially if you were doing it solely for personal convenience, not wanting to "cause a problem".

I'm not suspending anything. The rule *allows* a change in starter for an illegal shirt -- it does NOT forbid me from giving 30 seconds to a minute for a player to change the shirt.

It would take longer to explain the rule to the coach and require new starters and get them properly marked in the book for me to let the kid(s) change out of the illegal shirts.

Sometimes it's better for you and for the game to put a little oil on that wheel.

[Freddy]

Originally Posted by Rich

I'm not suspending anything. The rule *allows* a change in starter for an illegal shirt -- it does NOT forbid me from giving 30 seconds to a minute for a player to change the shirt.

It would take longer to explain the rule to the coach and require new starters and get them properly marked in the book for me to let the kid(s) change out of the illegal shirts.

Sometimes it's better for you and for the game to put a little oil on that wheel.

I'm all for tactful application of petroleum product to expedite the process and get on to all the non-fashion police aspects of the game.
I'm also aware that there are two specific coaches in our area, each adept at the rules, who would make this an issue if we granted the leeway I'd probably otherwise give with other coaches who could care less.
Therefore I'd hesitate to make a blanket policy to cover my setting aside a rule. Sometimes? Perhaps. Always? Um, no.
And no, I don't tend to be an O.O.O. Just hate it for the phone to ring and it being my assigner on the other end. Cuz his first question is gonna be, "Can I support your decision by rule?"
Then again, not such a big deal, cuz we'll probably catch it during warmups anyway.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Freddy

Just hate it for the phone to ring and it being my assigner on the other end. Cuz his first question is gonna be, "Can I support your decision by rule?"

Do we have the same assigner?

[bainsey]

And, sure enough, guess what happened today?

Blue team had one starter wear a black t-shirt. Told to the coach to put in another starter while he went to the locker room to change. Made the change in the book, no penalty.

This forum follows you, I swear!

[JetMetFan]

Had it happen once, three years ago in a BV game. Home team's starting PG had a maroon long sleeved shirt under his white jersey. Told HC the kid couldn't play with the shirt on (didn't see it until we were getting ready for the jump-ball because of the warm-up jersey). Kid starts to take off the jersey at the bench. I tell the HC he can't do that or else it's a T. I tell HC give me a sub and tell the kid to go change in the hallway.

The most annoying part about the scenario was my partner thought the maroon shirt was okay since it was one of the colors in the home team's jersey. Sigh...

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by egj13

Sure enough if I didn't read this yesterday and then have it happen last night. All of the starters were ok...but about 5 minutes into the 1st Q, A6 comes into the game with a green jersey and black t-shirt. I step in and ask the young man to go take it off...HC says he looked it up before the game and it can be black, white or jersey color...one partner says he isn't sure, R says just leave it alone. There I was on my own little island...SMH

Originally Posted by Freddy

I don't tend to be an O.O.O. Just hate it for the phone to ring and it being my assigner on the other end. Cuz his first question is gonna be, "Can I support your decision by rule?"

And there's the rub. egj13, I feel your pain but if you were 100% sure you were right - and you were - go for it. If the assignor calls and asks - and some might - at least you did your due diligence, especially if the R told you to leave it alone.

BTW, there's an NCAAW coordinator - and, presumably, a crew - who received a call last night from the SRE because officials allowed the following in a D1 game:



The eyes are everywhere.

[Raymond]

For those who do not have the list of acronyms, SRE = secretary rules editor.

[Raymond]

SMFH, y'all are some frickin' jinxes.

First HS assignment of season. BJV/BV DH. I'm R for JV game. Both teams wearing wam up tops for lay up line. As I'm getting ready to administer opening tap, U2 holds me up. 2 home team players are wearing black t-shirts. I send them off to change and they remain starters.

Funny thing is that it turns out the JV coach thought the sleeve rule applied to t-shirt sleeves, not to the actual shooting sleeves.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by Freddy

I'm sure the opposing coach who knows the rule wouldn't consider your suspending of a clear rule a "big deal", especially if you were doing it solely for personal convenience, not wanting to "cause a problem".

What "clear rule" is being suspended??

There is nothing in the rule book that says we can't send the kid to change and take an extra 30 seconds before we toss the ball.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

Why cause a problem? Just let them change their shirts and delay the game a couple of minutes. I understand not wanting to hold the game up for it, but I don't see the big deal.

Thx Bryan,

If they can correct it within a minute that's fine. rule says it is supposed to be a T to delay game for more than a minute. so they can delay game by less than a minute. that should be enough time to fix it so your likely not going to have to replace starters etc. However, if they can't fix it in a minute i don't have any problem telling them to replace them. i won't wait minutes for this one.

as i said, its not a big deal--just another call. so the starters check in at the first dead ball... the referee didn't cause the problem. if it was a new rule or something obscure id look at it differently. But this is 5th grade stuff--coaching 101…having 3 players, who i assume are on a varsity team, come out with black shirts under white uniforms falls into the major coaching/player screwup category. there may be things id delay longer than a minute for….this isn't one of them.
i do agree with Rich that some times putting oil on the wheel is better…i just don't see this situation as needing it. thx

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BigCat

Thx Bryan,

If they can correct it within a minute that's fine. rule says it is supposed to be a T to delay game for more than a minute. so they can delay game by less than a minute. that should be enough time to fix it so your likely not going to have to replace starters etc. However, if they can't fix it in a minute i don't have any problem telling them to replace them. i won't wait minutes for this one.

as i said, its not a big deal--just another call. so the starters check in at the first dead ball... the referee didn't cause the problem. if it was a new rule or something obscure id look at it differently. But this is 5th grade stuff--coaching 101…having 3 players, who i assume are on a varsity team, come out with black shirts under white uniforms falls into the major coaching/player screwup category. there may be things id delay longer than a minute for….this isn't one of them.
i do agree with Rich that some times putting oil on the wheel is better…i just don't see this situation as needing it. thx

It normally takes them 30 seconds to go into the hallway and come back. It's like magic. They don't have to go to the locker room. That still gives him a few seconds to throw his illegal undershirt to his girlfriend.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by Adam

It normally takes them 30 seconds to go into the hallway and come back. It's like magic. They don't have to go to the locker room. That still gives him a few seconds to throw his illegal undershirt to his girlfriend.

i agree it really shouldn't ever be an issue. but a team goofy enough to have 3 starters with black undershirts may send them all the way to the locker room, instead of telling them to take them off in the hall…..

[egj13]

Sure enough if I didn't read this yesterday and then have it happen last night. All of the starters were ok...but about 5 minutes into the 1st Q, A6 comes into the game with a green jersey and black t-shirt. I step in and ask the young man to go take it off...HC says he looked it up before the game and it can be black, white or jersey color...one partner says he isn't sure, R says just leave it alone. There I was on my own little island...SMH