The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Basketball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 15, 2014, 09:08am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Kansas
Posts: 633
Clever Ruse

Was working a youth (8th grade boys) game on Sat., score was 45(team A)- 44 (team B), time left = 45 secs. Team A had ball and all during game they were feeding this really talented big kid the ball down low (i.e., kid could really execute the drop step and spin moves in the post; but was a poor defensive player and had 4 fouls). Team B calls time out and just prior to play resuming, a guard from Team B comes over to me (mind you I am in the trail position now) and tells me "mr. referee watch me I'm going to draw a charge foul on the center). I said "OK". So when play resumes the Team A throws ball into the post, big kid Team A drop steps and the guard on Team B "flops". Team A wins by 5 pts.
*I guess the coach of Team B told the kid to tell me that he was going to draw a charge. I am soooooo glad my crew member in the lead position did NOT buy into the flop!
*Coaches always working the angles---
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 15, 2014, 10:45am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 18,016
?????
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 15, 2014, 11:40am
AremRed
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
?????
TL;DR: Coach A wants to foul out other teams best player (Player B1). Coach A tells Player A1 player to draw a charge on Player B1, but tell the official first so he can expect it. Player A1 tells wrong official, primary official doesn't bite on the flop.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 15, 2014, 12:35pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Kansas
Posts: 633
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
?????
*are you saying you did not comprehend my post OR are you questioning the stratagem of the Teams?
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 15, 2014, 01:13pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 18,016
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kansas Ref View Post
*are you saying you did not comprehend my post OR are you questioning the stratagem of the Teams?
I didn't quite understand the point of the post. I didn't see a question; I don't think it was a "clever ruse"; players and coaches have been known to tell an official to watch for something that they are about to run; ...

edit: I also don't mean that to sound as curmudgeonly as it might. I'm just trying to clarify if there's something for me to learn, or something for us to address.

Last edited by bob jenkins; Mon Sep 15, 2014 at 01:40pm.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 15, 2014, 01:20pm
Do not give a damn!!
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: On the border
Posts: 30,463
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kansas Ref View Post
*are you saying you did not comprehend my post OR are you questioning the stratagem of the Teams?
I was a little confused as well. Coaches try to tell us what to call or tell us what they are doing all the time. That is nothing new to many of us that have been out there for some time. Actually I am surprised when a coach does not try to influence what we call in some way or inventive way.

Peace
__________________
Let us get into "Good Trouble."
-----------------------------------------------------------
Charles Michael “Mick” Chambers (1947-2010)
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 15, 2014, 01:53pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Kansas
Posts: 633
ahhh OK, fellow refs: actually it's the first time it has happened to me in such a --shall I say--direct manner. Nevertheless, I can see that most of you did comprehend the intent of post.
I must confess, I did find it amusing tho that the kid was being "put up to"--however, he was telling the wrong ref
Thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 15, 2014, 02:34pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Denver Colorado
Posts: 736
I thought you were going to go into how Team B can take a timeout when Team A has the ball. Now that is a clever ruse.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 15, 2014, 02:44pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Arlington, TX
Posts: 270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toren View Post
I thought you were going to go into how Team B can take a timeout when Team A has the ball. Now that is a clever ruse.
I'm thinking maybe a dead ball...but I could be wrong.
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 15, 2014, 03:06pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 18,016
Quote:
Originally Posted by BatteryPowered View Post
I'm thinking maybe a dead ball...but I could be wrong.
Can a team "have" a dead ball?

and, I think you're giving the kids way too much credit if you think they should know which official will be responsible for a potential charge play. Heck, if you saw the flop then you would also have seen any foul and it's likely (in my mind's eye) that it would be such a play that you should go get it if your partner didn't.
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 15, 2014, 03:09pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Arlington, TX
Posts: 270
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
Can a team "have" a dead ball?

and, I think you're giving the kids way too much credit if you think they should know which official will be responsible for a potential charge play. Heck, if you saw the flop then you would also have seen any foul and it's likely (in my mind's eye) that it would be such a play that you should go get it if your partner didn't.

I didn't say team A "had" a dead ball...I said maybe there WAS a dead ball.

And I agree...many kids at the high school level wouldn't know which official to tell, much less a junior high kid.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 15, 2014, 11:23pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 297
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kansas Ref View Post
Was working a youth (8th grade boys) game on Sat., score was 45(team A)- 44 (team B), time left = 45 secs. Team A had ball and all during game they were feeding this really talented big kid the ball down low (i.e., kid could really execute the drop step and spin moves in the post; but was a poor defensive player and had 4 fouls). Team B calls time out and just prior to play resuming, a guard from Team B comes over to me (mind you I am in the trail position now) and tells me "mr. referee watch me I'm going to draw a charge foul on the center). I said "OK". So when play resumes the Team A throws ball into the post, big kid Team A drop steps and the guard on Team B "flops". Team A wins by 5 pts.
*I guess the coach of Team B told the kid to tell me that he was going to draw a charge. I am soooooo glad my crew member in the lead position did NOT buy into the flop!
*Coaches always working the angles---
Coach waits all game to make an adjustment and that's what he comes up with? Have the guard cover their talented big man, and hope he commits a charge?
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Tue Sep 16, 2014, 01:31pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Kansas
Posts: 633
you know how those coaches are always working the angles--can't blame them though, I'd prolly do the same if I (Heaven-forbid ) was ever a hoops coach!
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Tue Sep 16, 2014, 02:23pm
Adam's Avatar
Keeper of the HAMMER
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: MST
Posts: 27,190
Coaches who intentionally tell their kids to cheat aren't working the angles, they're cheating. They can call it "working the angles," but it's deceitful and cheating.
__________________
Sprinkles are for winners.
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Tue Sep 16, 2014, 03:20pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 8,033
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam View Post
Coaches who intentionally tell their kids to cheat aren't working the angles, they're cheating. They can call it "working the angles," but it's deceitful and cheating.
Maybe he wasn't teaching him to cheat. maybe he told the kid to go in there, guard the behemoth and take a charge ... and the kid either didn't know how to or was afraid to get too close.
__________________
I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'”

West Houston Mike
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Clever Play jmaellis Softball 2 Sat Jun 14, 2008 09:34am
How clever... rainmaker Basketball 4 Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:35am
Clever Adam Basketball 5 Fri Dec 10, 2004 09:08pm
Clever? or a violation ,trying 2 avoid a violation hardwdref Basketball 3 Sat Nov 13, 2004 04:17pm
Clever Solution to a Tricky Dilemma rainmaker Basketball 5 Sat Dec 15, 2001 11:44am


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:57am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1