Clever Ruse

Kansas Ref · #1 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 15, 2014, 09:08am

Was working a youth (8th grade boys) game on Sat., score was 45(team A)- 44 (team B), time left = 45 secs. Team A had ball and all during game they were feeding this really talented big kid the ball down low (i.e., kid could really execute the drop step and spin moves in the post; but was a poor defensive player and had 4 fouls). Team B calls time out and just prior to play resuming, a guard from Team B comes over to me (mind you I am in the trail position now) and tells me "mr. referee watch me I'm going to draw a charge foul on the center). I said "OK". So when play resumes the Team A throws ball into the post, big kid Team A drop steps and the guard on Team B "flops". Team A wins by 5 pts.
*I guess the coach of Team B told the kid to tell me that he was going to draw a charge. I am soooooo glad my crew member in the lead position did NOT buy into the flop!
*Coaches always working the angles---

bob jenkins · #2 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 15, 2014, 10:45am

?????

#3 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 15, 2014, 11:40am

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

?????

TL;DR: Coach A wants to foul out other teams best player (Player B1). Coach A tells Player A1 player to draw a charge on Player B1, but tell the official first so he can expect it. Player A1 tells wrong official, primary official doesn't bite on the flop.

Kansas Ref · #4 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 15, 2014, 12:35pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

?????

*are you saying you did not comprehend my post OR are you questioning the stratagem of the Teams?

bob jenkins · #5 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 15, 2014, 01:13pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kansas Ref

*are you saying you did not comprehend my post OR are you questioning the stratagem of the Teams?

I didn't quite understand the point of the post. I didn't see a question; I don't think it was a "clever ruse"; players and coaches have been known to tell an official to watch for something that they are about to run; ...

edit: I also don't mean that to sound as curmudgeonly as it might. I'm just trying to clarify if there's something for me to learn, or something for us to address.

JRutledge · #6 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 15, 2014, 01:20pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kansas Ref

*are you saying you did not comprehend my post OR are you questioning the stratagem of the Teams?

I was a little confused as well. Coaches try to tell us what to call or tell us what they are doing all the time. That is nothing new to many of us that have been out there for some time. Actually I am surprised when a coach does not try to influence what we call in some way or inventive way.

Peace

Kansas Ref · #7 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 15, 2014, 01:53pm

ahhh OK, fellow refs: actually it's the first time it has happened to me in such a --shall I say--direct manner. Nevertheless, I can see that most of you did comprehend the intent of post.
I must confess, I did find it amusing tho that the kid was being "put up to"--however, he was telling the wrong ref

Thanks.

Toren · #8 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 15, 2014, 02:34pm

I thought you were going to go into how Team B can take a timeout when Team A has the ball. Now that is a clever ruse.

Coach Bill · #9 (**permalink**) Mon Sep 15, 2014, 11:23pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kansas Ref

Was working a youth (8th grade boys) game on Sat., score was 45(team A)- 44 (team B), time left = 45 secs. Team A had ball and all during game they were feeding this really talented big kid the ball down low (i.e., kid could really execute the drop step and spin moves in the post; but was a poor defensive player and had 4 fouls). Team B calls time out and just prior to play resuming, a guard from Team B comes over to me (mind you I am in the trail position now) and tells me "mr. referee watch me I'm going to draw a charge foul on the center). I said "OK". So when play resumes the Team A throws ball into the post, big kid Team A drop steps and the guard on Team B "flops". Team A wins by 5 pts.
*I guess the coach of Team B told the kid to tell me that he was going to draw a charge. I am soooooo glad my crew member in the lead position did NOT buy into the flop!
*Coaches always working the angles---

Coach waits all game to make an adjustment and that's what he comes up with? Have the guard cover their talented big man, and hope he commits a charge?

Kansas Ref · #10 (**permalink**) Tue Sep 16, 2014, 01:31pm

you know how those coaches are always working the angles--can't blame them though, I'd prolly do the same if I (Heaven-forbid

) was ever a hoops coach!

Adam · #11 (**permalink**) Tue Sep 16, 2014, 02:23pm

Coaches who intentionally tell their kids to cheat aren't working the angles, they're cheating. They can call it "working the angles," but it's deceitful and cheating.

MD Longhorn · #12 (**permalink**) Tue Sep 16, 2014, 03:20pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam

Coaches who intentionally tell their kids to cheat aren't working the angles, they're cheating. They can call it "working the angles," but it's deceitful and cheating.

Maybe he wasn't teaching him to cheat. maybe he told the kid to go in there, guard the behemoth and take a charge ... and the kid either didn't know how to or was afraid to get too close.

Adam · #13 (**permalink**) Tue Sep 16, 2014, 03:44pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Maybe he wasn't teaching him to cheat. maybe he told the kid to go in there, guard the behemoth and take a charge ... and the kid either didn't know how to or was afraid to get too close.

Yep, then the coach wasn't "working the angles." That's different.

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