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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 10:00am
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Transitioning 3-man to 2-man crew.

I not sure if any of you refs have encountered this issue or probably have but for me this particular issue I found noteworthy. During the season I do 3-man crew, with summer club basketball I'm assigned to 2-man crews. There's a lot more court to cover---whew! lots more running around compared to 3 man crew. Also, a LOT more walking around to report fouls--often I or partner has to come wayyy over from otherside of court to report foul and in rotation I come wayyyy over to the baseline to replace the ref who went tableside. Reffing these summer club basketball = more walking+more work - less money
I guess the what makes this situation entirely ironic (and amusing to me) is that when I first started in the hoops Ref business I got started with the YMCA youth leagues and it was always 2-man crews and this required continual hustling, running, and rotating but I never really got winded. I guess now I' have become "fat and pampered" by doing 3-man such that the tasks of doing 2-man has become tiring. But hey. . . this club league pays me a game check prior to even me reffing the first game of a 4-game set---so I can only complain to my fellow Ref colleagues
Anyone else experiencing the same with summer hoop youth leagues?
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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 10:08am
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I cannot speak for you, but summer ball is just summer ball. I do not compare the two and the actions I do during the summer. Yes, there is more walking, but that is because the environment is more laid back and not as "serious." Heck they are not paying us more and we are often not working the same amount time in each games and multiple games in a situation. I do not even try to compare a regular season situation to a summer, off-season situation because of the nature of how these games are taken. Heck we might not even get other rules that are strict, so why make our mechanics the same feeling?

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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 11:24am
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I also look at in season scholastic games and recreation/summer league games as two different things.

In season games we go to the site 45 minutes - 1 hr before game time, change into uniform at the school, and generally work only one game per night (my association does sometimes assign two game sets (e.g. Freshman and Varsity (so the varsity official can evaluate the JV game officials, or a non-varsity official might work the JV game and then work as the Clock operator for Varsity).

For recreation, we are expected to show up in uniform, 15 minutes before gametime and generally work either 2 or 3 game sets.

No point in comparing the two different types in my opinion. I use the recreation games to focus on specific things that I want to improve on, but it it also common to not make all the switches and "save steps" when reporting fouls in the interest of keeping the game moving. There is often only 1 hr or 1 hr and 15 minutes to finish the game before the next game is starting so if it were run like an in-season game then we would get off schedule pretty quick.
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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 12:57pm
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Here are some tips I have picked up for summer ball to conserve energy and not move as much. Take them as you will.

Report from a distance so you don't have to switch
Walk up the floor as Trail whenever possible
Jog from T to new Lead, but start walking once you hit the FTLE
As Lead bring all endline throw-ins that go out between the extended lane lines to your side
Sit down during timeouts when possible
Speed up putting the ball in play when possible
Don't chase the ball, have the players do it
Administer the ball from a distance when appropriate (i.e. not during a press)
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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 01:06pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AremRed View Post
Here are some tips I have picked up for summer ball to conserve energy and not move as much. Take them as you will.

Walk up the floor as Trail whenever possible
Jog from T to new Lead, but start walking once you hit the FTLE
As Lead bring all endline throw-ins that go out between the extended lane lines to your side
Sit down during timeouts when possible
Things are a little different around here. I have always looked at how I perform during summer ball as not much different to how I perform during the regular season. I hustle, I put the ball in play where it's supposed to be put in play, I would never sit down during the game. If you accept a game and you're getting paid, you should do the job. If you don't think it's enough money, don't take the game. I'm happy to only work for an assignor who expects this of everyone. It burns my a$$ when my partner walks down the court. I realize I'm in the minority here, but that's just my own philosophy.
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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 01:15pm
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In summer ball I will continue to hustle. I almost always work no more than 3 games in a day. The most I'll work is 4, and there has to be at least a one game break after the 2nd or 3rd game. I refuse to work any amount of games that would cause me to be so tired as to walk during transition.
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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 01:18pm
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Originally Posted by BadNewsRef View Post
In summer ball I will continue to hustle. I almost always work no more than 3 games in a day. The most I'll work is 4, and there has to be at least a one game break after the 2nd or 3rd game. I refuse to work any amount of games that would cause me to be so tired as to walk during transition.
Same here. Even when I was younger and could run all day, I still couldn't stay focused beyond 4 games. There's no way anyone can work 6 games in a day and do a good job in game 6.
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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 02:19pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AremRed View Post
Here are some tips I have picked up for summer ball to conserve energy and not move as much. Take them as you will.

Report from a distance so you don't have to switch
Walk up the floor as Trail whenever possible
Jog from T to new Lead, but start walking once you hit the FTLE
As Lead bring all endline throw-ins that go out between the extended lane lines to your side
Sit down during timeouts when possible
Speed up putting the ball in play when possible
Don't chase the ball, have the players do it
Administer the ball from a distance when appropriate (i.e. not during a press)
My opinion ... some of these are bad tips and make you look weak as an official.

Reporting from a distance (if done with good signals and a loud voice) or administering the throw in from a distance is fairly common in all the recreation/summer ball I've seen and is helpful to avoid long or unnecessary switches -- I usually differ to my partner as to how much switching to do since I'm generally the younger/newer of the crew, but if we are limiting switching then I do both of these things.

On the other hand, walking up the floor, or not hustling all the way to the endline, putting the ball in play at the wrong spot, or sitting during timeouts will make you stand out (and not in a good way). Being seen as lazy is not a label I want.

Our association has also told us explicitly not to "tell the players to get the ball", so that's a no for me as well.
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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 02:33pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AremRed View Post
Here are some tips I have picked up for summer ball to conserve energy and not move as much. Take them as you will.

Report from a distance so you don't have to switch
Walk up the floor as Trail whenever possible
Jog from T to new Lead, but start walking once you hit the FTLE
As Lead bring all endline throw-ins that go out between the extended lane lines to your side
Sit down during timeouts when possible
Speed up putting the ball in play when possible
Don't chase the ball, have the players do it
Administer the ball from a distance when appropriate (i.e. not during a press)
I disagree with just about every one of these. They may save you a few steps per game but they all make the official look lazy and/or inept. If you accept the assignment, do it to the best of your ability in a professional manner. Hustle, use good mechanics, and portray a professional image. All of the above convey the exact opposite.
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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 02:33pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HokiePaul View Post
My opinion ... some of these are bad tips and make you look weak as an official.

Reporting from a distance (if done with good signals and a loud voice) or administering the throw in from a distance is fairly common in all the recreation/summer ball I've seen and is helpful to avoid long or unnecessary switches -- I usually differ to my partner as to how much switching to do since I'm generally the younger/newer of the crew, but if we are limiting switching then I do both of these things.

On the other hand, walking up the floor, or not hustling all the way to the endline, putting the ball in play at the wrong spot, or sitting during timeouts will make you stand out (and not in a good way). Being seen as lazy is not a label I want.

Our association has also told us explicitly not to "tell the players to get the ball", so that's a no for me as well.
I never tell a player to get the ball. But I stand there until it's brought to me. With a running clock (in the summer), I usually don't have to wait long.
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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 03:01pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef View Post
In summer ball I will continue to hustle. I almost always work no more than 3 games in a day. The most I'll work is 4, and there has to be at least a one game break after the 2nd or 3rd game. I refuse to work any amount of games that would cause me to be so tired as to walk during transition.
I hustle as well, but we do not switch and do the dead ball stuff the same (switching, mechanics movement, substitution procedures). That is usually to cut time out of dead time because the clock is moving. Otherwise the running from one position to another is practically the same.

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Last edited by JRutledge; Wed Jul 16, 2014 at 03:16pm.
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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 07:59pm
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I don't work the summer AAU circuit around here for one simple reason--the organization refuses to pay the officials enough. During the regular season, the two-man fee is $60 and 3-man is $50 for varsity games (plus a travel fee), yet during AAU tournaments the organizers want the officials to accept $30 & no travel fee for a two-man game which is stop-clock and the same amount of playing time as a HS contest (either four 8-minute quarters or two 16-minute halves). Why? Because they wish to put the rest of the money in their pockets!
My answer is to not work those events until they become willing to pay what has been established by the high school administrators and the association leadership to be a fair fee.
Sadly, I frequently see people trying to work six or seven games per day at these tournaments. They are stupid and don't realize that if they refused, the tourney would have to raise the rates in order to attract more officials and they could make the same amount while working far fewer games!

Note: my comments apply to AAU games involving players of HS age. I don't care what they pay for little kid games because I'm not interested in officiating those. To me that's not basketball, it's babysitting.
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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 08:14pm
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Originally Posted by Nevadaref View Post
I don't work the summer AAU circuit around here for one simple reason--the organization refuses to pay the officials enough. During the regular season, the two-man fee is $60 and 3-man is $50 for varsity games (plus a travel fee), yet during AAU tournaments the organizers want the officials to accept $30 & no travel fee for a two-man game which is stop-clock and the same amount of playing time as a HS contest (either four 8-minute quarters or two 16-minute halves). Why? Because they wish to put the rest of the money in their pockets!
My answer is to not work those events until they become willing to pay what has been established by the high school administrators and the association leadership to be a fair fee.
Sadly, I frequently see people trying to work six or seven games per day at these tournaments. They are stupid and don't realize that if they refused, the tourney would have to raise the rates in order to attract more officials and they could make the same amount while working far fewer games!

Note: my comments apply to AAU games involving players of HS age. I don't care what they pay for little kid games because I'm not interested in officiating those. To me that's not basketball, it's babysitting.
I'm amazed that locally AAU games pay $20 and people that assign act as though that's a great deal. It's a key reason I simply don't work summer basketball unless I'm going to a camp (and then I'll work only to shake off the rust).
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Old Wed Jul 16, 2014, 08:35pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AremRed View Post
Here are some tips I have picked up for summer ball to conserve energy and not move as much. Take them as you will.

Report from a distance so you don't have to switch
Walk up the floor as Trail whenever possible
Jog from T to new Lead, but start walking once you hit the FTLE
As Lead bring all endline throw-ins that go out between the extended lane lines to your side
Sit down during timeouts when possible
Speed up putting the ball in play when possible
Don't chase the ball, have the players do it
Administer the ball from a distance when appropriate (i.e. not during a press)
Bad advice.
You never know who is watching.

We can take some shortcuts but we are still getting paid to do a job so do it the best you can. That said, we won't long switch on non-shooting fouls but other than that, I don't want to seem lazy or bored, nor do I want to get bad habits. I still hustle to report fouls but my reporting area is larger. Never sit during a game and my pet peeve, keep phones out of sight. I saw an official wearing one on hip. Checked it on every time out.
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Old Thu Jul 17, 2014, 07:46am
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Caveat Reftor

Quote:
Originally Posted by AremRed View Post
Here are some tips I have picked up for summer ball to conserve energy and not move as much. Take them as you will.

Report from a distance so you don't have to switch
Walk up the floor as Trail whenever possible
Jog from T to new Lead, but start walking once you hit the FTLE
As Lead bring all endline throw-ins that go out between the extended lane lines to your side
Sit down during timeouts when possible
Speed up putting the ball in play when possible
Don't chase the ball, have the players do it
Administer the ball from a distance when appropriate (i.e. not during a press)
If this post had a "Like" button I would not click on it.
REAL LIFE PROBLEM WITH THIS:
Some (read: "toooooooooo many") engrain these as habits during summer ball and are unable to abandon them once the high school season starts.
You?
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