Timing question

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by deecee

Although I would hope that the official would have better game awareness than calling this foul, unless its a hatchet job, because in reality this shot "technically" won't count had the foul not occur. Even though I strongly believe in calling a foul when it occurs, there are rare instances where common sense, and awareness needs to be present.

Could you explain this further please?

[APG]

Originally Posted by walt

The basket doesn't count because the ball was not released prior to time expiring. However, since he was in the act of shooting when the foul occurred, two (or three) free throws are awarded. If the ball was in flight when time expired, count it.

Originally Posted by JeffM

No basket, but shoot free throws (unless it is end of the game and free throws are meaningless).

This is only true if you don't have definite knowledge as to what to put on the clock. In the OP, the clock erroneously expired and you have the definite knowledge as to how much time is on the clock.

In this case, count the basket and put .1 on the clock.

[deecee]

Originally Posted by just another ref

Could you explain this further please?

Sometimes lack of awareness and maybe a desire to show that you know the rules puts an official in predicaments that they (heck not many really) may be ill-equipped to handle.

Short of a very obvious foul in such an instance I don't see why an official would want to call something ticky-tacky.

In this instance barring a foul the shot would be waved off. Why reward the offense for marginal contact?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by deecee

Sometimes lack of awareness and maybe a desire to show that you know the rules puts an official in predicaments that they (heck not many really) may be ill-equipped to handle.

Short of a very obvious foul in such an instance I don't see why an official would want to call something ticky-tacky.

In this instance barring a foul the shot would be waved off. Why reward the offense for marginal contact?

Ignoring the coach-speak, if the defense commits a foul on that shot, I'm leaning towards assuming the offense might have released the shot in time. The rule isn't that hard to administer (people have been shooting free throws with time expired since the invention of free throws.

[deecee]

I agree, and what I was trying to say, was that I try harder to not call ticky-tack fouls at the expiration of time. Without replay ability there are times when whistle and horn are so close it's hard to discern. Heck even with replay its hard as there is no sound with slo mo.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by deecee

I agree, and what I was trying to say, was that I try harder to not call ticky-tack fouls at the expiration of time. Without replay ability there are times when whistle and horn are so close it's hard to discern. Heck even with replay its hard as there is no sound with slo mo.

Honestly, I don't worry about "ticky-tack" fouls anyway. I'm not even sure what that means, because the coaches I hear the phrase from don't seem to have any consistent meaning behind it. Really, it just means any foul against their team where blood wasn't drawn.

Frankly, if my whistle blows at or after the horn on a foul I know happened before the horn, I've got no problem making the call.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by deecee

I agree, and what I was trying to say, was that I try harder to not call ticky-tack fouls at the expiration of time. Without replay ability there are times when whistle and horn are so close it's hard to discern. Heck even with replay its hard as there is no sound with slo mo.

I try hard not to call those fouls all the time, but I'm sure you're not saying otherwise.

Guessing on what to put on the clock is a dangerous game. With replay I'm happy to do it and I'll go by the time of the foul absent other instructions.

We had a state quarterfinal game (called a sectional final here) on Saturday and I called a foul on a made basket and the clock ran out at the end of the third quarter. It was so loud, I never heard a horn. I needed to ask my partners if a horn sounded. Once I did, then the next question was did either of them have definite knowledge of the time on the clock when the whistle blew.

We ended up shooting the throws with the lane cleared.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Rich

I'll go by the time of the foul ... definite knowledge of the time on the clock when the whistle blew.

Time of the foul, or time of the whistle for said foul, because they probably aren't the same time.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Time of the foul, or time of the whistle for said foul, because they probably aren't the same time.

Depends if I have a monitor.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by deecee

Sometimes lack of awareness and maybe a desire to show that you know the rules puts an official in predicaments that they (heck not many really) may be ill-equipped to handle.

Short of a very obvious foul in such an instance I don't see why an official would want to call something ticky-tacky.

In this instance barring a foul the shot would be waved off. Why reward the offense for marginal contact?

Nowhere in the OP does it say the foul was "ticky-tacky" or "marginal."

And, those types of contact shouldn't (generally) be called at any time.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by deecee

In this instance barring a foul the shot would be waved off. Why reward the offense for marginal contact?

If this comment is made with respect to the OP, then you are reading additional info into that post. It does not state that the clock was stopped and play resumed with 0.2 on the game clock.
It merely tells us that the shooter begins his motion at that time.