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  #46 (permalink)  
Old Fri Aug 16, 2013, 12:54pm
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Politically Correct..........

When she first started posting she was a shy flower who was intimidated by male coaches. Now all of a sudden she has the wisdom and courage of Teddy V. and Eric Brewton [/QUOTE]

Teddy V. and Eric Brewton....got both the men's and women's game covered....thought you would say Bernie Clinton and Dwayne Gladden so you could suck up for more games !!!!!
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Last edited by Multiple Sports; Fri Aug 16, 2013 at 02:45pm.
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  #47 (permalink)  
Old Fri Aug 16, 2013, 02:29pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Multiple Sports View Post
When she first started posting she was a shy flower who was intimidated by male coaches. Now all of a sudden she has the wisdom and courage of Teddy V. and Eric Brewton
Teddy V. and Eric Brewton....got both the men's and women's game covered....thought you would say Bernie Clinton and Dwayne Gladden so you could suck up for more games ... [/QUOTE]

Sucking up doesn't get you college games. Around here it will get you a decent HS schedule though.
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  #48 (permalink)  
Old Mon Aug 19, 2013, 11:28pm
AremRed
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Yep, totally agree on this. However I am stuck trying to figure out why those guys didn't say this. I was surprised at how vehemently they told me never to call outside my areas.
JetMetFan, I got in touch with a guy from the camp and asked him to clarify what the clinicians meant. He said that plays like this do need to be called, and that you shouldn't call small, regular stuff outside your area. As a crew you need to take care of these types of collisions for all the reasons you and JRut mentioned. I only wish they had told me this at the time.
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  #49 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 20, 2013, 06:27am
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Originally Posted by AremRed View Post
JetMetFan, I got in touch with a guy from the camp and asked him to clarify what the clinicians meant. He said that plays like this do need to be called, and that you shouldn't call small, regular stuff outside your area. As a crew you need to take care of these types of collisions for all the reasons you and JRut mentioned. I only wish they had told me this at the time.
At least he clarified it for you. I figured that was the case since I've heard it from every D1 official I've ever run into in a camp situation.
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  #50 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 20, 2013, 12:00pm
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Misdemeanor vs. Felony

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Originally Posted by JetMetFan View Post
At least he clarified it for you. I figured that was the case since I've heard it from every D1 official I've ever run into in a camp situation.
These plays were best explained to me like this......

If a guy drives his car 56 mph and the speed limit is 55, if my partner doesn't write him a ticket, why am I getting involved..... Misdemeanor

However - if he commits armed robbery and robs a bank, I am going to arrest him regardless what my partner thinks..... Felony

I beleive video one is a felony........
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  #51 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 20, 2013, 12:31pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Multiple Sports View Post
These plays were best explained to me like this......

If a guy drives his car 56 mph and the speed limit is 55, if my partner doesn't write him a ticket, why am I getting involved..... Misdemeanor

However - if he commits armed robbery and robs a bank, I am going to arrest him regardless what my partner thinks..... Felony

I beleive video one is a felony........

But are you going to arrest what may be the victim if you have a poor view of the crime just so you can arrest someone?

The T in this play had no chance to see through all of the bodies between him and the play. There were at least 3-4 directly in his line of sight to the play. The C probably had a much more open look, even if it was way out of their primary.
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Last edited by Camron Rust; Tue Aug 20, 2013 at 12:40pm.
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  #52 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 20, 2013, 12:34pm
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Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
And all I have ever noticed about previous playing experience is it helps an official with strategy and understanding what is going on from a team aspect, but not necessarily their rules or mechanics knowledge.

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Hey, that is 100% on the money!
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  #53 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 20, 2013, 12:37pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Multiple Sports View Post
These plays were best explained to me like this......

If a guy drives his car 56 mph and the speed limit is 55, if my partner doesn't write him a ticket, why am I getting involved..... Misdemeanor

However - if he commits armed robbery and robs a bank, I am going to arrest him regardless what my partner thinks..... Felony

I beleive video one is a felony........
Get the elephants, not the ants. Everyone can see the elephants.

Peace
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  #54 (permalink)  
Old Tue Aug 20, 2013, 04:38pm
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The Pink Elephant In The Room ???

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Originally Posted by Multiple Sports View Post
Misdemeanor ...Felony.
Good metaphor. Here in my little corner of Connecticut, we refer to such plays as ants, and elephants, same as in JRutledge's Chicagoland (his little northeast corner if Illinois).
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 21, 2013, 02:58am
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Originally Posted by BillyMac View Post
Good metaphor. Here in my little corner of Connecticut, we refer to such plays as ants, and elephants, same as in JRutledge's Chicagoland (his little northeast corner if Illinois).


Billy, my comment or reference did not just come directly from where I live. I have been to camps in other states and heard the same language or reference. BTW, Chicago and the suburbs, the population is larger then your entire state. We do not have one voice or standard as you would like to suggest. We have people with all kinds of experiences and work all kinds of levels. Things are a lot broader then a little corner.

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  #56 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 21, 2013, 06:24am
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All Politics Is Local (Thomas Phillip " Tip" O'Neill, Jr.) ...

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Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
Chicago and the suburbs, the population is larger then your entire state.
Yeah, go ahead just keep rubbing it in. And I bet that you guys don't use button hooks anymore to tie your shoes before a game.
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Last edited by Adam; Wed Aug 21, 2013 at 08:36am. Reason: clean up in aisle 56
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  #57 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 21, 2013, 10:32am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust View Post
But are you going to arrest what may be the victim if you have a poor view of the crime just so you can arrest someone?

The T in this play had no chance to see through all of the bodies between him and the play. There were at least 3-4 directly in his line of sight to the play. The C probably had a much more open look, even if it was way out of their primary.
In this case? Yes, unfortunately. After the game the crew can figure out why the play was FUBAR. During the game, someone has to do something for the reasons Jeff and I mentioned before. On a play like that it's going to be next to impossible to tell a coach, your observer or your supervisor that no one saw it or that is was incidental. Granted you don't want to screw it up but a no-call looks much worse.
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  #58 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 21, 2013, 11:27am
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Originally Posted by JetMetFan View Post
In this case? Yes, unfortunately. After the game the crew can figure out why the play was FUBAR. During the game, someone has to do something for the reasons Jeff and I mentioned before. On a play like that it's going to be next to impossible to tell a coach, your observer or your supervisor that no one saw it or that is was incidental. Granted you don't want to screw it up but a no-call looks much worse.
You know what, I just watched this video again. I think what got this all started bad was that the lead was not refereeing the defense and was left not knowing how the defender got there. He seemed to be tracking the dribbler in, even after the dribbler beat the initial defender. No need to be watching the dribbler. That is what set up this mess.

I just don't like guesses that penalize the wrong player...which is what the trail did. I don't think he had any look at the play at all and came up with a whistle and made up a call simply because he saw two bodies go down. I think there should have been call but I just think that guessing (and getting it wrong) is worse....even worse than a blarge.
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  #59 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 21, 2013, 11:54am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust View Post
You know what, I just watched this video again. I think what got this all started bad was that the lead was not refereeing the defense and was left not knowing how the defender got there. He seemed to be tracking the dribbler in, even after the dribbler beat the initial defender. No need to be watching the dribbler. That is what set up this mess.

.
For a little defense of the L, he does have responsibility for the drive in NCAAW floor coverage. That said, I do agree with you that he had no idea that secondary defender was there because he turned his head rather than moving wider.

And the C actually has an amazing look at that first play as the waters parted right in front of her. Maybe if she had gotten the whistle they would have gotten that call correct?
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  #60 (permalink)  
Old Wed Aug 21, 2013, 12:12pm
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Great Posts!!!!!!

Cam and RR -

I think both of your last posts bring up great points, however Cam we are just going to have to disagree.... If you are lead in a game where I am the T, I will have a whistle on that play if you don't every time. If the roles are reversed, then it will have to be a play on, unless you are comfortable with your look and then I can only hope you will come save the crew......

One of my closest friends is an observer for the NBA ( BNR no wise cracks neccessary ) and he says with a secondary defender both C & T should get looks so they can have a whistle on this play.

Cam maybe this will be play of the year on the Reftown site ......
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