Things Officials Should Probably Not Be Saying In A Game ...

[Rooster]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Rooster: Without a smilie, I can't tell if your serious, or trying to be funny, or sarcastic, or what? In any case, I hate your idea. This sounds like the rules clinic that JRutledge is trying to avoid, and something that, I think, JRutledge, and I, can agree upon 100%.

Plus, only one foot has to remain over the thirty-six inch "spot", there is actually quite a bit of movement allowed on a designated spot throwin. Get out your tape measure and give it a try.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Eitehr way it goes, I am still saying, "Don't move." I think it makes little difference and nothing I have heard changes my mind or seems relevent to what a player thinks they can or cannot do.

Peace

Not trying to be funny or sarcastic. JRutledge said he hadn't heard anything that he would use instead of "Don't move." I was trying to come up with something that can be communicated quickly, that is factually correct, and lets a thrower know what he/she CAN do.

I don't see this as a rules clinic, but that's me.

I do know that "only one foot has to remain over the thirty-six inch "spot", there is actually quite a bit of movement allowed on a designated spot throw-in." See post #88

Hate is a strong word, doncha think?

I thinks that's enough smilies for now...

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Rooster

Hate is a strong word, doncha think?

Yes I do. I apologize. I fixed it. Ask anybody on the Forum, I may post some pretty stupid things, but I always, and I mean always, try to be polite. Sorry. Please don't tell my Mom. She would be very disappointed in me, and in our Irish Catholic family, we're really good about making family members feel guilty, and she's better at it than anybody else in the family. She's what you would call a "Guilt Expert".

[JeffM]

I understand that saying "on the floor" is considered unacceptable so I stopped saying it.

However, I think it quickly conveys the essential information that the foul was before the shot.

So, I have said "spot" or "designated spot" instead. However, many players don't seem to understand what that means and I've been asked by players if it was a shooting foul.

I've also used "white ball" which seems to works better.

So, what is the best way to say it? I don't think that "before the shot" would be any more acceptable than "on the floor".

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by JeffM

I understand that saying "on the floor" is considered unacceptable so I stopped saying it.

However, I think it quickly conveys the essential information that the foul was before the shot.

So, I have said "spot" or "designated spot" instead. However, many players don't seem to understand what that means and I've been asked by players if it was a shooting foul.

I've also used "white ball" which seems to works better.

So, what is the best way to say it? I don't think that "before the shot" would be any more acceptable than "on the floor".

I personally have no problem with "on the floor." Everybody knows what it means, even if they don't know why it means what it means.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by just another ref

Even if they don't know why it means what it means.

Cool sounding statement.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by JeffM

I understand that saying "on the floor" is considered unacceptable so I stopped saying it.

However, I think it quickly conveys the essential information that the foul was before the shot.

So, I have said "spot" or "designated spot" instead. However, many players don't seem to understand what that means and I've been asked by players if it was a shooting foul.

I've also used "white ball" which seems to works better.

So, what is the best way to say it? I don't think that "before the shot" would be any more acceptable than "on the floor".

Like I noted, the vast majority of the time, people get the intended meaning. However, simply saying "before the shot" when required gets the same point across without conveying the idea that if the shooter was on the floor when he was fouled he won't get free throws. And yes, I get that question a lot from coaches and players.

"Wasn't he on the floor?"

"Yes, but he had started his shot."

At best, this ends with a blank stare. At worst, it ends with a snarky comment from the referee. Somewhere in the middle of those, it ends with a technical foul.

[APG]

Originally Posted by JeffM

I understand that saying "on the floor" is considered unacceptable so I stopped saying it.

However, I think it quickly conveys the essential information that the foul was before the shot.

So, I have said "spot" or "designated spot" instead. However, many players don't seem to understand what that means and I've been asked by players if it was a shooting foul.

I've also used "white ball" which seems to works better.

So, what is the best way to say it? I don't think that "before the shot" would be any more acceptable than "on the floor".

A simple no shot (use the wave off if need be). Follow that with the team and where the throw-in will be if you feel like it.

Originally Posted by just another ref

I personally have no problem with "on the floor." Everybody knows what it means, even if they don't know why it means what it means.

Everyone knows what "over the back" means but we still don't want officials reporting fouls as "over the back" or even have it in their lexicon.

I can also say that in my experience, officials that use "on the floor" are generally poor at applying continuous motion, and I wouldn't doubt that using this phrase somehow influences their thinking in that a player on the floor isn't in the act.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by APG

Everyone knows what "over the back" means but we still don't want officials reporting fouls as "over the back" or even have it in their lexicon.

I am not so sure about that. People usually only complain about this when the "back" is involved and they often think their is something special about the back for a call to be made. I do not year someone complain when someone is out jumped while facing their opponent. And they often use that term when little or no contact took place.

Originally Posted by APG

I can also say that in my experience, officials that use "on the floor" are generally poor at applying continuous motion, and I wouldn't doubt that using this phrase somehow influences their thinking in that a player on the floor isn't in the act.

My experience as well. And most officials that use that term actually penalize the shooter for being on the floor or never getting off the floor during the foul when it is obvious they could not have been doing anything else but shooting the basketball. So that is one reason to not use the term IMO. And when you call a shooting foul while a player is on the floor or never is able to jump, the question you hear, "Ref wasn't he on the floor?" Those are much more compelling things to not say because the rule is completely misunderstood or applied improperly by those that use that term. I am not hearing anyone say an official misapplied a rule on a throw-in for what they might have said or did not say.

Peace

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by JeffM

I understand that saying "on the floor" is considered unacceptable so I stopped saying it.

However, I think it quickly conveys the essential information that the foul was before the shot.

So, I have said "spot" or "designated spot" instead. However, many players don't seem to understand what that means and I've been asked by players if it was a shooting foul.

I've also used "white ball" which seems to works better.

So, what is the best way to say it? I don't think that "before the shot" would be any more acceptable than "on the floor".

"before the shot" is just as easy to say as "on the floor" but is actually accurate in its meaning since it says that the foul occurred before the shot. A player could be shooting while still "on the floor" so a player could be getting 2 FTs having been on the floor. Why confuse thing when you don't need to?

"Spot" isn't used at the time of a foul but when administering the throwin on the backcourt endline mostly after a timeout.

[just another ref]

If one assumes that the use of "on the floor" means an official doesn't understand continuous motion, one could also assume that an official who says "don't move" doesn't understand the details of a spot throw-in.

One thing has nothing to do with the other.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by just another ref

If one assumes that the use of "on the floor" means an official doesn't understand continuous motion, one could also assume that an official who says "don't move" doesn't understand the details of a spot throw-in.

One thing has nothing to do with the other.

Yup. So many inconsistencies.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by just another ref

If one assumes that the use of "on the floor" means an official doesn't understand continuous motion, one could also assume that an official who says "don't move" doesn't understand the details of a spot throw-in.

One thing has nothing to do with the other.

Well when you find that person, let me know. I have yet to meet that person that has ever been confused by the other term. Or better yet, I have never met the person that does not move literally.

Peace

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Well when you find that person, let me know. I have yet to meet that person that has ever been confused by the other term.

Diogenes, is that you?

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Why confuse things when you don't need to ...

... or don't have to? Thus, the purpose of my list.

[JeffM]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

"before the shot" is just as easy to say as "on the floor" but is actually accurate in its meaning since it says that the foul occurred before the shot. A player could be shooting while still "on the floor" so a player could be getting 2 FTs having been on the floor. Why confuse thing when you don't need to?

"Spot" isn't used at the time of a foul but when administering the throwin on the backcourt endline mostly after a timeout.

Thanks - I'll go with "before the shot".