Michigan-Louisville clip rebounding no call (6:51 2nd half)

[#olderthanilook]

Video is fairly conclusive....the post player traveled at least twice.

The first travel occurs when his back is to the bucket and lifts both feet before starting a dribble. The second is when he falls backward trying to avoid good defensive position by the Michigan big blocking his direct path to the rim.

AND, how about #7 for L'ville running out of bounds along the baseline (to avoid his own player, no less) just prior to the L'ville big traveling the first time?

Hello.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Well it cannot be a travel if you do not have control of the ball. It cannot be a held ball unless you judge at the NCAA level that he had control of the ball on the way down. Once again, there is a debate we can have about how much control the UL player had during his move to the basket. The UL player does try to take on two players to shoot through. It is very likely the ball is being knocked around.

Peace

So, a ball that never leaves a player's hands is not in control???

WOW. Keep making stuff up. You're good at it.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by #olderthanilook

AND, how about #7 for L'ville running out of bounds along the baseline (to avoid his own player, no less) ...?

Hello.

Your point?

That is not illegal at the NCAA unless the ball is thrown to #7 as he returns inbounds.

(That is the way the NFHS rule should be)

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

So, a ball that never leaves a player's hands is not in control???

WOW. Keep making stuff up. You're good at it.

Never leaves his hands? You telling me the ball is not being knocked around at all?

I believe someone showed an example of a held ball and the question in the video was if the player hand complete control the entire time. That play previously in the tournament that was shown here was called a held ball and people here questioned if you could have a held ball for the very same reason I am questioning here. I guess you have never seen a ball handler try to split to players and ball get slightly knocked out of his hand, but have people want a travel when the ball handler has lost control? I see that often and do not call a travel for the very same reasons. Had that happen in the post season and me and my partner commented to each other during half time why we did not call a travel in that play. And this is about what the officials on the game saw or what they think they saw. They had a much better angle or perspective than anyone here would have. And I bet if you asked them they probably did not see control. Just like the held ball in the WSU-UL game they called a held ball quickly on one of the last possessions of that game and people debated if that was a good call.

Peace

[#olderthanilook]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Your point?

That is not illegal at the NCAA unless the ball is thrown to #7 as he returns inbounds.

(That is the way the NFHS rule should be)

I'm just a NFHS peon. Hence, my surprise that a player can simply run off the playing court for no apparent reason other than to gain an advantage during a live ball.

Didn't know the NCAA didn't concern itsself with players leaving and re-entering the court on their own terms.

Interesting, to say the least.

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by #olderthanilook

AND, how about #7 for L'ville running out of bounds along the baseline (to avoid his own player, no less) just prior to the L'ville big traveling the first time?

If there was a #7 out there for Louisville the crew was having more problems than we thought.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by #olderthanilook

I'm just a NFHS peon. Hence, my surprise that a player can simply run off the playing court for no apparent reason other than to gain an advantage during a live ball.

Didn't know the NCAA didn't concern itsself with players leaving and re-entering the court on their own terms.

Interesting, to say the least.

They do concern themselves with it, but it's only penalized if the departed player is the first to touch or receive the ball once he is no longer departed.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by #olderthanilook

I'm just a NFHS peon. Hence, my surprise that a player can simply run off the playing court for no apparent reason other than to gain an advantage during a live ball.

Didn't know the NCAA didn't concern itsself with players leaving and re-entering the court on their own terms.

Interesting, to say the least.

Not an issue of not being concerned, the rules are not the same.

Peace

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Adam

They do concern themselves with it, but it's only penalized if the departed player is the first to touch or receive the ball once he is no longer departed.

Precisely, they deal with it when it has an effect....the way it should be.

[#olderthanilook]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Not an issue of not being concerned, the rules are not the same.

Peace

In other words, they aren't concerned about it or there would be a rule in place.

[#olderthanilook]

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

If there was a #7 out there for Louisville the crew was having more problems than we thought.

It looks like Smith, but I'm not enough of a fan to know his number. Maybe he's #1???

[peachbasket]

I am not a travel guy and probably would have missed the first travel on the initial rebound by Deng where he split his feet prior to dribbling....the second move he made was a travel as he lost balance and initiated contact....

On this play in retrospect, it would have been nice to get one of those travels, preferably the second one as it was most obvious, then the rest of the play would not have to be officiated.

Travels are hard in the post, especially at L when you are trying to referee contact on the torso's of each player. Sometimes, even a very wide position at L that allows L to see more of play from head to toe does not help because our focus is looking for contact. That is why we all say it is nice for T to help with travels that are obvious and no brainers - not gotchya's.

This play was at C, so while C has a wide angle, he is officiating for contact on the defender. Essentially same principles that apply to L when the play is on his near block.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by #olderthanilook

It looks like Smith, but I'm not enough of a fan to know his number. Maybe he's #1???

The point is, it can't be #7. It's not a legal number in NCAA (and NFHS) rules.