Marginally interesting article

[MD Longhorn]

Not singling you guys out, and I promise not to label you as sexist for your honest and open responses.

I'm wondering why the aversion to calling the girls game. It can't just be general talent level, or you'd be refusing boys games with two bad teams and maybe even accepting girls games with two good ones. I'm genuinely curious as to the reasons.

(Personal experience, and this is likely an over-exaggeration, but the JH and HS boys coaches around here are FAR tougher to deal with than the JH and HS girls coaches).

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Not singling you guys out, and I promise not to label you as sexist for your honest and open responses.

I'm wondering why the aversion to calling the girls game. It can't just be general talent level, or you'd be refusing boys games with two bad teams and maybe even accepting girls games with two good ones. I'm genuinely curious as to the reasons.

(Personal experience, and this is likely an over-exaggeration, but the JH and HS boys coaches around here are FAR tougher to deal with than the JH and HS girls coaches).

I've always received my HS games through an association commissioner. Over the years, as I improved, I received fewer and fewer girls games. This year I worked for 2 different associations and was assigned exactly 1 girls game and that game got snowed out.

I also only receive JV games if they are part of a DH. I have a very good female friend who quit working HS games b/c the commissioner wouldn't give her any boys games.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Not singling you guys out, and I promise not to label you as sexist for your honest and open responses.

I'm wondering why the aversion to calling the girls game. It can't just be general talent level, or you'd be refusing boys games with two bad teams and maybe even accepting girls games with two good ones. I'm genuinely curious as to the reasons.

(Personal experience, and this is likely an over-exaggeration, but the JH and HS boys coaches around here are FAR tougher to deal with than the JH and HS girls coaches).

I have no desire to work a game that looks nothing like what I want to advance in at either college or HS. I think it is really hard to go back and forth and do them adequately.

Another factor, in my state we have the option to work either boys playoffs or girls playoffs. And if I were to work girls playoffs then I would have to likely turn back games that I have assigned for girls games. And I like only working 3 games and 4 at the most in a week (and that usually involves a college game or two). Working both genders would or potentially take that up to 5 or 6 in a week. I also have other things I like to do and I want to continue officiating and doing that many days a week (and working 3 sports on top of that) would just make me want to quit overall or burn out quickly. And this also does not include that when I started officiating I never even though of doing girls games because I clearly did not watch that side of the sport before I officiated and it was never in my plans or goals to advance in that level.

The bottom line when I leave my house, I have to like what I am about to do or change what I am doing or quit what I am doing. I do not begrudge those guys that want to work both, but I see no point personally. And it would cause problems with certain assignors if I am constantly trying to walk that line doing both.

Peace

[zm1283]

If officials here were allowed to decline girls games, there wouldn't be enough people to work those games. We have all games assigned by one assigner and we can't decline games that are assigned. The guys high up in the pecking order don't work much if any girls basketball though. Then the majority of us work both boys and girls at various ratios of each. Then there are officials who work almost all or all girls basketball.

[Rich]

The honest answer: Because I have fun in about 10% of the ones I work.

I am working 3 postseason girls games and I expect that the first two will be in the 90% category and the last one will be in the 10% category.

Trust me when I say I give all of these games all of the hard work I can. I just don't want to after this season. 26 years is enough.

[Nikki]

New to this site (well actually I think I did some lurking here a few yrs ago) but this subject is one that hits close to home with me.
A little history: I am a girl, I have been officiating basketball at some level since I was 12 yrs old (my dad refs and when I was old enough he sent me to do the pee wee games), I had shoulder surgery this past October and have not worked this season at all.
I am considering doing high school ball next yr after about 7 yrs of only working women's college ball (juco, DIII, NAIA).
I know I will be considered a newbie but I have no desire to work 2 man or ONLY girls games. There are just very few competitive girls games to work. I think all varsity games in my area are 3 man games so that shouldn't be a problem. Still trying to figure out what I will do next season...

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by zm1283

If officials here were allowed to decline girls games, there wouldn't be enough people to work those games. We have all games assigned by one assigner and we can't decline games that are assigned. The guys high up in the pecking order don't work much if any girls basketball though. Then the majority of us work both boys and girls at various ratios of each. Then there are officials who work almost all or all girls basketball.

That might be an issue in some areas, but not an issue here. We have nearly 6000 officials statewide and there are more than enough to cover each gender regularly. It is just that the quality of girls officials are not up to standard IMO and that is more because officials can advance quicker on that side than on the boys side.

Peace

[VaTerp]

Very interesting article that bring up two related but separate issues IMO.

1) There is no question that 3 officials is preferable to 2. The girls coaches make contradictory, circular, and nonsensical arguments for voting against having 3 person crews for their games. It could be a Title IX issue but the coaches passed on the opportunity. Not sure what they're suggesting to resolve the issues they cite either.

2) The assignments of boys vs girls games is another issue and something I'm very curious about. In my scholastic association, there is no distinction between boys and girls officials. For the most part, you are expected to work what you are assigned. Our assignor does not like officials who turn back girls games or make it clear that boys games are all they're willing to work.

But the established top officials do very few girls games. We have some fairly good female officials but I think only 1 or 2 of them get any boys games. And those are few and far between.

This is my 4th year in my association. My first year I probably got 50-50 boys/girls. Second year 60/40 and last year roughly 70/30. Last season I got a boys regional semi-final and a girls state quarterfinal. This year, I got a boys regional final and will do a girls state semi. So it seems like I am moving up in the hierarchy but sort of have to pay dues with advancing further on the girls side first.

I have no problem with this and am thankful for the schedule I get. In fact, I will take a good girls game over a bad boys game most days of the week. But I do agree with some of what JRut was saying though in that I want to move up to doing NCAAM and working girls HS games doesnt help me in that pursuit. All things considered I'd rather focus on doing just boys games but that's not really a workable option right now in my association.

Ideally I think you should have a separate pool of officials for boys and girls. The concern would be having the numbers to support it, particularly on the girls side. But I think once certain officials realize they are not being assigned to work a lot or getting good games they would realize they could do better on the girls side. Similar to NCAA (and not saying that's the reason people go the NCAAW route) in having a totally seperate pool of quality officials.

Also, I think at least in my association they could do a better job of recruiting and developing female officials for girls games. I've literally seen some women who can get college games sooner than they can get GV games. Doesnt make a whole lot of sense.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Not singling you guys out, and I promise not to label you as sexist for your honest and open responses.

I'm wondering why the aversion to calling the girls game. It can't just be general talent level, or you'd be refusing boys games with two bad teams and maybe even accepting girls games with two good ones. I'm genuinely curious as to the reasons.

(Personal experience, and this is likely an over-exaggeration, but the JH and HS boys coaches around here are FAR tougher to deal with than the JH and HS girls coaches).

Personally, I enjoy working both boys and girls basketball. However, I think they're basically two different games which happen to share rules. The mind set for officiating them are completely different. Requiring referees to do both is akin to requiring all baseball umpire to do softball as well. Some will enjoy it while others will seek to only do one or the other.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

Personally, I enjoy working both boys and girls basketball. However, I think they're basically two different games which happen to share rules. The mind set for officiating them are completely different. Requiring referees to do both is akin to requiring all baseball umpire to do softball as well. Some will enjoy it while others will seek to only do one or the other.

I can relate to that, and on the smallball side, I now only do Softball unless begged to work baseball somewhere. My reason is not talent or ball-quality. But rather a mix of what Rich said and what Jeff said. I have "fun" at a far lower percentage of baseball games than softball games... and I think focusing on one has made me better in that one... similar rules, but the release point and the action on the ball during the pitch is COMPLETELY different, and I find it takes me several baseball games to get back to a good strike zone there, while I can step completely unprepared into a softball game and call a good zone.

So I kind of get what all 3 of your are saying. Good answers and thanks for the honesty.