The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Basketball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 05, 2012, 03:20pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 5
Simultaneous Free Throw Violation

One of those things you read about but never think you'll go through. Well, we went through it last night.

I'm filling in on a boys freshman game.

33-32 team A leading, 10 seconds left.

A1 is at the line for the first of bonus free throws (1-and-1). A1 releases the shot, and B5 steps into the lane before the ball hits the rim. I'm L on the endline and give the prelim signal. Ball bounces off the rim, high in the air, then bounces again off the rim and B2 grabs it.

I blow my whistle, announce the violation on B and re-administer the foul shot. A1 makes the first free throw, misses the second. B rebounds, dribbles down the floor and misses a last second shot to tie it up.

We get back in the locker room and my partner says "I'm sure glad you blew that violation on B, because the ball hit the basket support up top off that same free throw."



We should have had a simultaneous violation and gone with the arrow, I says. He's not sure so we go digging through the rule book, and sure enough, there's 9-1-4.

Even worse, while we're digging through the rule book, one of the JV officials is overhearing our conversation in the locker room and says "Oh, I wouldn't overthink it. I'd just call the violation on B and get it over with. I mean, no coach is going to like that answer."

I answered back with "I don't care what the coach thinks, I'm getting it right."

No surprise that this guy has been a JV coach for the past 8 seasons...he picked the stripes back up this year.
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 05, 2012, 03:25pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Denver Colorado
Posts: 736
For clarity

You are saying that A1's shot hit the rim, then bounced and hit the support on the backboard?
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 05, 2012, 03:26pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 18,016
Quote:
Originally Posted by jayhop View Post
We should have had a simultaneous violation and gone with the arrow, I says.
Incorrect.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 05, 2012, 03:27pm
APG APG is offline
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 5,889
2012-2013 Interpretations

SITUATION 1: While A1's free throw is in flight, B1, in a marked lane space, enters the lane. A1's free throw hits the ring and bounces straight up and hits a wire over the basket or hits the ring and goes over the backboard. RULING: The official should sound the whistle and call a violation on B1. A1 is given a substitute free throw. (9-1-4 Penalty 2b)
__________________
Chaos isn't a pit. Chaos is a ladder. Many who try to climb it fail and never get to try again. The fall breaks them. And some, given a chance to climb, they refuse. They cling to the realm, or the gods, or love. Illusions.

Only the ladder is real. The climb is all there is.

Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 05, 2012, 03:30pm
Do not give a damn!!
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: On the border
Posts: 30,463
I do not think this is a violation on A. B5 violated and A misses shot hitting an out of bounds spot is not associated with a violation on a FT. If he missed the rim then that is another story.

Peace
__________________
Let us get into "Good Trouble."
-----------------------------------------------------------
Charles Michael “Mick” Chambers (1947-2010)
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 05, 2012, 03:36pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 5
Well there you go. Thanks guys. I read 9-1-4 and mistakenly assumed missing the rim was the same as hitting an OOB spot on the free throw (ie, a violation).

Thanks for the clarification.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 05, 2012, 03:37pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,262
Quote:
Originally Posted by APG View Post
2012-2013 Interpretations

SITUATION 1: While A1's free throw is in flight, B1, in a marked lane space, enters the lane. A1's free throw hits the ring and bounces straight up and hits a wire over the basket or hits the ring and goes over the backboard. RULING: The official should sound the whistle and call a violation on B1. A1 is given a substitute free throw. (9-1-4 Penalty 2b)
However, what if A1's shot is a high arcing shot which hits a backboard support (such as a the strap used to raise the backboard) before making contact with the rim? Then A1 has violated and we would have simultaneous violations, right?
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Wed Dec 05, 2012, 04:08pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 18,016
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eastshire View Post
However, what if A1's shot is a high arcing shot which hits a backboard support (such as a the strap used to raise the backboard) before making contact with the rim? Then A1 has violated and we would have simultaneous violations, right?
It would be treated as a simultaneous violation.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Thu Dec 06, 2012, 10:12am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 782
Even, even worse. . .

Even worse, while we're digging through the rule book, one of the JV officials is overhearing our conversation in the locker room and says "Oh, I wouldn't overthink it. I'd just call the violation on B and get it over with. I mean, no coach is going to like that answer."

I answered back with "I don't care what the coach thinks, I'm getting it right."

No surprise that this guy has been a JV coach for the past 8 seasons...he picked the stripes back up this year.

Seems the JV official you dissed was correct. . . (maybe he reads this Forum, and was soft-selling his input.)
__________________
To be good at a sport, one must be smart enough to play the game -- and dumb enough to think that it's important . . .

Last edited by Rob1968; Thu Dec 06, 2012 at 10:13am. Reason: better sentence structure
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Thu Dec 06, 2012, 08:16pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 5
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob1968 View Post
Seems the JV official you dissed was correct. . . (maybe he reads this Forum, and was soft-selling his input.)
Actually, he wasn't correct. He made no commentary on the actual rule, he was saying you should just call whatever seems most obvious and would be easiest to "sell" to the coaches.

I wasn't dissing him. I was pointing out that we shouldn't make calls based on what the coaches think, we should make calls based on the rules.

Thanks for your input, though.
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Thu Dec 06, 2012, 08:31pm
Adam's Avatar
Keeper of the HAMMER
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: MST
Posts: 27,190
Your last paragraph sure came across as an insult.
__________________
Sprinkles are for winners.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Thu Dec 06, 2012, 08:37pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 5
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam View Post
Your last paragraph sure came across as an insult.
Well, if you had been in the locker room, you would have understood the situation. Welcome to the communication limitations of an online discussion board.

If anything, what the JV ref said was an insult. He was borderline mocking us for digging into the rulebooks to try and find out if/what we messed up.
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Thu Dec 06, 2012, 09:03pm
Adam's Avatar
Keeper of the HAMMER
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: MST
Posts: 27,190
Quote:
Originally Posted by jayhop View Post
Well, if you had been in the locker room, you would have understood the situation. Welcome to the communication limitations of an online discussion board.

If anything, what the JV ref said was an insult. He was borderline mocking us for digging into the rulebooks to try and find out if/what we messed up.
I'm not saying he didn't deserve a bit of ridicule.
__________________
Sprinkles are for winners.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Thu Dec 06, 2012, 09:55pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 14,616
Quote:
Originally Posted by jayhop View Post
Actually, he wasn't correct.
Actually he was correct. You were over thinking it.
__________________
"...as cool as the other side of the pillow." - Stuart Scott

"You should never be proud of doing the right thing." - Dean Smith
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Thu Dec 06, 2012, 11:06pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: N.D.
Posts: 1,829
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
I do not think this is a violation on A. B5 violated and A misses shot hitting an out of bounds spot is not associated with a violation on a FT. If he missed the rim then that is another story.

Peace
Agreed. No different than the ball hitting the rim and then bouncing OOB.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Free Throw Violation? ca_rumperee Basketball 3 Thu Feb 14, 2008 10:42am
Free Throw Violation OklahomaRef Basketball 5 Sun Feb 04, 2007 06:17am
Free Throw Violation? RunninRef Basketball 20 Sun Dec 10, 2006 05:23pm
No Rim Violation on free throw coach41 Basketball 5 Mon Dec 19, 2005 08:15pm
Free Throw Violation fref Basketball 3 Wed May 21, 2003 05:23pm


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:30am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1