Tonight's game

[JugglingReferee]

I had a single game tonight. It was the boys varsity championship.

I'm curious about 2 calls, and would like your opinion. My partner is a veteran official who can referee well.

#1: Team B gets possession on a steal on the left wing and B2 from the right wing breaks right away. A2 stays with him, but is 1 step behind him. B1, who stole the ball from A1, passes to B2, who receives the pass in his FC, between the 3-point line and the centre circle. B2 is going to dunk. However, his pivot foot comes up before the ball goes down. I'm the new L in transition and without missing a heartbeat, call the travel. Crowd doesn't like it at all. Our evaluator suggests to let that travel go because it's a breakaway (even though A1 is just 1 step behind) and it's going to be a dunk.

Would you pass on this for any reason? Would the spread matter? Would the type of game matter: regular season vs. city final? (This discussion point came up a few years ago and those that work college ball up here say to let it go. I say call it what it is and let the actions of the players decide what to call.)

I like what my P said in the post-game: "we're not in the entertainment business."


#2: 2nd half, I'm L opposite side. A1 drives from the T's side, above the FT line extended. So, iow, no need for me to be looking there at all - I'm 100% off-ball. Drive comes down to just outside the block on the T's side - never entering the key. Bam! Contact on the torso between A1 and B1. B1 was the primary defender. B1 goes down to the floor - "medium hard" (think steak cooking ). I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that it was a PC foul. Yes, I do think there was enough contact for it to be called.

But since the play started outside my area, finished outside my area (debatable perhaps), and involved A1 and B1, I'm only going to grab that foul if my partner is weak. Since my P is obviously not weak, I pass on the call. Our evaluator said he'd rather see a call in that case.

Would you call it? Does the ability of your P matter? Would you call it even if you were straight-lined at the time of contact? (I positioned myself to referee the matchups in the paint rather than something outside my area.)


Other situations: Naturally it's going to get *very* loud in the gym due to the nature of the game. We tell the coaches in the pre-game, to use their voice and a hand signal when requesting a time-out. We also tell them it would help if they told use ahead of time when they intend to request a timeout (again, because of the ambient noise level). (Eg: you're reporting a foul and the coach says "timeout if we make the last free-throw".)

Sure enough, this happens, but since there's no signal for "TO after a made FT", and just a signal for a TO, I grant a "future TO request". The gym was fairly quiet but this coach didn't use his voice at all to add the "after we score the 2nd free throw". Grrrr. I guess it came back to bite us in the a$$.

Other #2: We stopped the clutching and grabbing early and they played a great game without that nonsense stuff. There was still the odd foul for a hold to prevent getting beat off the dribble, but all in all it was pretty cleaned up.

Other #3: I went sans-lanyard. It is fun! My evaluator said go for it! lol Mind you, he and I did the semi together sans-lanyard.

[bob jenkins]

#1 -- If it's clear that he travelled, get it. But a strong benefit of the doubt goes to the offense (i.e., legal play) here.

#2 -- If you had a competitive match-up, then you need to stay with it. If not, know that this is the type of play on which a T often needs help and expand your area.

[SmokeEater]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

#1 -- if it's clear that he travelled, get it. But a strong benefit of the doubt goes to the offense (i.e., legal play) here.

#2 -- if you had a competitive match-up, then you need to stay with it. If not, know that this is the type of play on which a t often needs help and expand your area.

+1

[ref2coach]

OK, I have a question. You state "#2: 2nd half, I'm L opposite side. A1 drives from the T's side, above the FT line extended."

If you are lead "opposite side" wouldn't the T be on your side? Did the drive in question actually come from the "C's" primary?

[Toren]

Originally Posted by ref2coach

OK, I have a question. You state "#2: 2nd half, I'm L opposite side. A1 drives from the T's side, above the FT line extended."

If you are lead "opposite side" wouldn't the T be on your side? Did the drive in question actually come from the "C's" primary?

It reads like 2 man mechanics. He says in the OP that his partner, not partners.

[Amesman]

Originally Posted by ref2coach

OK, I have a question. You state "#2: 2nd half, I'm L opposite side. A1 drives from the T's side, above the FT line extended."

If you are lead "opposite side" wouldn't the T be on your side? Did the drive in question actually come from the "C's" primary?

Since OP mentioned only a singular "partner," it sounds like a two-official game.

[Toren]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

Other situations: Naturally it's going to get *very* loud in the gym due to the nature of the game. We tell the coaches in the pre-game, to use their voice and a hand signal when requesting a time-out. We also tell them it would help if they told use ahead of time when they intend to request a timeout (again, because of the ambient noise level). (Eg: you're reporting a foul and the coach says "timeout if we make the last free-throw".)

Sure enough, this happens, but since there's no signal for "TO after a made FT", and just a signal for a TO, I grant a "future TO request". The gym was fairly quiet but this coach didn't use his voice at all to add the "after we score the 2nd free throw". Grrrr. I guess it came back to bite us in the a$$.

We have been advised to not take advanced timeouts for playoffs. Since there is nothing that states a coach can tell you, "timeout if he makes it". We have been advised to tell the coach, "signal the timeout if he makes it and I will grant it coach."

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by Toren

We have been advised to not take advanced timeouts for playoffs. Since there is nothing that states a coach can tell you, "timeout if he makes it". We have been advised to tell the coach, "signal the timeout if he makes it and I will grant it coach."

Yes, I should have expanded on that. We did tell them it helps to know in advance, but they still must request when actually desired. Knowing ahead of time means we'll look for it.

[Toren]

Originally Posted by jugglingreferee

yes, i should have expanded on that. We did tell them it helps to know in advance, but they still must request when actually desired. Knowing ahead of time means we'll look for it.

+1

[Sharpshooternes]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

I had a single game tonight. It was the boys varsity championship.

#1: Team B gets possession on a steal on the left wing and B2 from the right wing breaks right away. A2 stays with him, but is 1 step behind him. B1, who stole the ball from A1, passes to B2, who receives the pass in his FC, between the 3-point line and the centre circle. B2 is going to dunk. However, his pivot foot comes up before the ball goes down. I'm the new L in transition and without missing a heartbeat, call the travel.

Was B2 on a dead run or at a standstill when he got the ball? In the air or on one foot? Can you elaborate a bit more?

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

I had a single game tonight. It was the boys varsity championship.

I'm curious about 2 calls, and would like your opinion. My partner is a veteran official who can referee well.

#1: Team B gets possession on a steal on the left wing and B2 from the right wing breaks right away. A2 stays with him, but is 1 step behind him. B1, who stole the ball from A1, passes to B2, who receives the pass in his FC, between the 3-point line and the centre circle. B2 is going to dunk. However, his pivot foot comes up before the ball goes down. I'm the new L in transition and without missing a heartbeat, call the travel. Crowd doesn't like it at all. Our evaluator suggests to let that travel go because it's a breakaway (even though A1 is just 1 step behind) and it's going to be a dunk.

Would you pass on this for any reason? Would the spread matter? Would the type of game matter: regular season vs. city final? (This discussion point came up a few years ago and those that work college ball up here say to let it go. I say call it what it is and let the actions of the players decide what to call.)

I like what my P said in the post-game: "we're not in the entertainment business."


#2: 2nd half, I'm L opposite side. A1 drives from the T's side, above the FT line extended. So, iow, no need for me to be looking there at all - I'm 100% off-ball. Drive comes down to just outside the block on the T's side - never entering the key. Bam! Contact on the torso between A1 and B1. B1 was the primary defender. B1 goes down to the floor - "medium hard" (think steak cooking ). I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that it was a PC foul. Yes, I do think there was enough contact for it to be called.

But since the play started outside my area, finished outside my area (debatable perhaps), and involved A1 and B1, I'm only going to grab that foul if my partner is weak. Since my P is obviously not weak, I pass on the call. Our evaluator said he'd rather see a call in that case.

Would you call it? Does the ability of your P matter? Would you call it even if you were straight-lined at the time of contact? (I positioned myself to referee the matchups in the paint rather than something outside my area.)


Other situations: Naturally it's going to get *very* loud in the gym due to the nature of the game. We tell the coaches in the pre-game, to use their voice and a hand signal when requesting a time-out. We also tell them it would help if they told use ahead of time when they intend to request a timeout (again, because of the ambient noise level). (Eg: you're reporting a foul and the coach says "timeout if we make the last free-throw".)

Sure enough, this happens, but since there's no signal for "TO after a made FT", and just a signal for a TO, I grant a "future TO request". The gym was fairly quiet but this coach didn't use his voice at all to add the "after we score the 2nd free throw". Grrrr. I guess it came back to bite us in the a$$.

Other #2: We stopped the clutching and grabbing early and they played a great game without that nonsense stuff. There was still the odd foul for a hold to prevent getting beat off the dribble, but all in all it was pretty cleaned up.

Other #3: I went sans-lanyard. It is fun! My evaluator said go for it! lol Mind you, he and I did the semi together sans-lanyard.

Like reffing at a nudist camp, other than 'fun' aspect, why?

[BLydic]

Originally Posted by Toren

We have been advised to not take advanced timeouts for playoffs. Since there is nothing that states a coach can tell you, "timeout if he makes it". We have been advised to tell the coach, "signal the timeout if he makes it and I will grant it coach."

Good advice! An esteemed, but absent member of this forum used to offer up the following. If the coach asks for a "future" timeout during free throws, the best (cya) is to let the coach know that you'll be looking for his/her request, but they will have to make it at the appropriate time.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by fullor30

Like reffing at a nudist camp, other than 'fun' aspect, why?

Because we can.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by Sharpshooternes

Was B2 on a dead run or at a standstill when he got the ball? In the air or on one foot? Can you elaborate a bit more?

I don't know what a dead run is, but B2 was running and caught the ball in stride from B1.

If they were playing football, it would have been a great pass from QB to receiver. Because B2 caught the ball outside the 3-point line, he couldn't dunk without a dribble, and therefore his foot movement was more restrictive.

[fiasco]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

Because we can.

Good answer. 'Nuff said.