JV Games

[Toren]

Before my varsity game last night, I decided to arrive early to the game and observe the JV game.

First call, L makes the call opposite paint and calls a block, player was standing there in LGP and the offensive player took 3 or 4 steps ad bull dozed him. Okay, his angle is different than mine, maybe he saw something else.

Second call, held ball, and then a little scuffle after between the two players involved in the held ball. The official says to the scoretable "I have a dead ball double personal foul".

At this point I decided to go get changed, I had seen enough. Not sure why I got so frustrated, but I was extremely frustrated at this point.


And then in my game, I kicked a pretty insignificant call, but I won't repeat that mistake. Player catches the ball and loses his balance, he reaches down with his offhand and balances himself. So he has two feet on ground, one hand on ground. It didn't look proper, so I tweet and signal travel. Nobody said anything, but as soon as I made the call, I'm questioning it. Halftime comes, nobody says anything and I had forgotten to check with my partners. I go home and I remember that I didn't like that call, look it up. Bam, 4-44-5, I was dead wrong. Ugh, well at least if that was the worst call I had all night, I'm alrigh I guess. Won't repeat that mistake.

[JugglingReferee]

I hear ya.

[Welpe]

Any chance you can reach out to these officials regarding what they had wrong?

[Toren]

Originally Posted by Welpe

Any chance you can reach out to these officials regarding what they had wrong?

Yeah I am going to, I'm a newer official and didn't want to come across like I'm better than them. I did get some advice from one of my veteran partners last night, who said I can phrase it, "Can I offer you a suggestion...".

I do want to help them get better but I felt uncomfortable just offering it without being asked. I think that wording will work for me though.

[Loudwhistle2]

Originally Posted by Welpe

Any chance you can reach out to these officials regarding what they had wrong?

With the folks I work with I usually start with "You're doing a great job out there and I have a couple of suggestions that will make you an even better ref. Want to hear them?" Well first off don't run backwards, its just a matter of time before you injure yourself. I noticed on the jump you left your whistle in your mouth while throwing up the ball. I would practice spitting your whistle out and then throwing the ball. Some refs have lost some teeth due to the whistle in their mouth. Etc...

[Adam]

There's a third category,those who are competent, content, and comfortable at that level.

Most varsity officials here will at least catch the third quarter, if not the first half, and most JV refs will ask if they saw anything.

[KJUmp]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

There's a third category,those who are competent, content, and comfortable at that level.

Most varsity officials here will at least catch the third quarter, if not the first half, and most JV refs will ask if they saw anything.

Thanks for posting that Snags.....because thats me.....to a T.

When I got into this in my late 50's, I gave myself three years to make our state board (two years is quickest you can do it) as a varsity official.
Last year, (my 3rd) after achieving the required passing score on the written exam, getting passing scores on all my in season JV game evaluations (done by V refs), I failed the end of season floor test.

After giving it my best effort for three years (and not getting any younger) I
chose to just work JV.

Working for two assignors, I work 2-3 JV (B&G) per week in my area. I am not affiliated in any way with the state board. I'm a member of NASO, I order the current NFHS Rule Book and Case Book each year, take practice tests whenever I can get access to them, read Referee, watch NFHS on-line video and spend a lot of time here trying to learn and stay abreast with rules, case book plays, interps, philosophies, mechanics, etc.
Whenever I have the occasion to work a JV game with an official who's in the process of trying to make the state board I make sure that as their partner to make every effort to help them have a good game...especially if it's a game where they are being evaluated. Good pre-game, switching on fouls, communication during time outs, etc.etc. I won't offer up any advice...that's for the board refs assigned to the V game to do.

So while I failed in my quest to earn a state patch, I do know that I'm a better referee than I was three years ago when I first started and will continue to work hard to become better....for no other reason than my own sense of professionalism and what I feel I owe my assignors and the schools who pay me to work their JV games.

So yes, I'm a content, comfortable, and IMO competent JV referee (still with a lot to learn)......no matter what preconceived notion a board official sitting in the stands waiting to work the varsity game may have of an "old" guy working a JV game.

[Freddy]

Originally Posted by KJUmp

. . . thats me.....to a T . . . I chose to just work JV. . . . I'm a member of NASO, I order the current NFHS Rule Book and Case Book each year, take practice tests whenever I can get access to them, read Referee, watch NFHS on-line video and spend a lot of time here trying to learn and stay abreast with rules, case book plays, interps, philosophies, mechanics, etc. I do know that I'm a better referee than I was three years ago when I first started and will continue to work hard to become better....for no other reason than my own sense of professionalism and what I feel I owe my assignors and the schools who pay me to work their JV games.

What a great point -- this third category!!! Yes, we do have a few somewhat like that, but not to the extent that you are.

[bowlingref]

I was 49 when I got back into officiating. I also had veterans helping me and giving suggestions. Lots of help. One thing about the officiating deal is when the veterans suggest something to you. It is not a do as I do deal,it is a do as I say do deal. I go to several games a year with out the whistle and I see the guys that have been telling me what do, doing the same things or worse.

[amusedofficial]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

There's a third category,those who are competent, content, and comfortable at that level..

Absolutely There are some who do it for the fun of it, and actually prefer a JV schedule rather than the commitment to V games, and which often requires later nights and less control over how far you travel. This is an avocation, not a vocation; sometimes far away basketball games at night are not compatible with one's occupation.

Others just don't think the "prestige" and extra 25 bucks is worth the aggravations associated with coaches who think they're the next Bobby Knight and fans who don't realize that the vast majority of basketball games involve average to sub-average teams, and, while the participants deserve a well-officiated game in which the players decide the outcome, the bell curve of the importance of the results peaks in the third quarter and approaches zero the minute you walk out the door.

Reffing is on the cusp of athletics, and in athletics you're supposed to aim for the highest level of competition possible. But there are very competent officials doing JV basketball who are neither auditioning nor fading and who are more skilled than some V officials.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by amusedofficial

Absolutely There are some who do it for the fun of it, and actually prefer a JV schedule rather than the commitment to V games, and which often requires later nights and less control over how far you travel. This is an avocation, not a vocation; sometimes far away basketball games at night are not compatible with one's occupation.

Others just don't think the "prestige" and extra 25 bucks is worth the aggravations associated with coaches who think they're the next Bobby Knight and fans who don't realize that the vast majority of basketball games involve average to sub-average teams, and, while the participants deserve a well-officiated game in which the players decide the outcome, the bell curve of the importance of the results peaks in the third quarter and approaches zero the minute you walk out the door.

Reffing is on the cusp of athletics, and in athletics you're supposed to aim for the highest level of competition possible. But there are very competent officials doing JV basketball who are neither auditioning nor fading and who are more skilled than some V officials.

I agree that this is a category some officials put themselves in, but that is a very very small minority in my experience. Or at least the small part is the guy that is so competent that they just stay at that level by their choice. Because if an official does this, they certainly are having to leave a job or other activities and get to a site earlier than a varsity official. Now they may get home earlier, but at least around here the earlier you have to leave the more traffic you have to fight. Usually in my experience the official that claims he does not want to do varsity has been not given the chance in the first place.

Peace

[ref2coach]

Originally Posted by amusedofficial

Others just don't think the "prestige" and extra 25 bucks is worth the aggravations associated with coaches who think they're the next Bobby Knight and fans who don't realize that the vast majority of basketball games involve average to sub-average teams, and, while the participants deserve a well-officiated game in which the players decide the outcome, the bell curve of the importance of the results peaks in the third quarter and approaches zero the minute you walk out the door.

Around here the difference is only $5 on a TWO game G/B set.

I live in a community that has all large-ish schools. So a JV DH puts me Home by 6:30 when My Var games puts Me home between 9:30 and 11. Many times working a JV DH is better ball than the Mid level Varsity games I have to travel farther to work.

Nights with a non-competitive, long commute Varsity game makes Me wish I had worked a local JV set.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

There's a third category,those who are competent, content, and comfortable at that level..

I work JV and Freshmen because basketball is my second sport and I don't want to deal with the politics and hassle required to get varsity assignments in my area for what ultimately for me is a way to stay fit and mentally sharp when it's too cold for soccer.

[ref3808]

In our neck of the woods officials assigned to the sub varisty games on a given day usually work both the Frosh and JV games. Many excellent officials opt for the two game checks and a schedule that typically starts at 3:30 and gets you out of the gym by 6:30. As a bonus, you're not dealing with the unfortunate circus that ofen develops around varisty contests. I don't think these are necessarily all guys or women on the way up, or the way down. More likely they are just doing something they love at a time and place and under the circumstances and conditions they choose.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Freddy

Would you agree that sublevel officials fall primarily into two categories? 1) those "on their way up and eager", and 2) those "on their way down and out.

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

There's a third category,those who are competent, content, and comfortable at that level.

I'm neither on my way up, nor on my way down. I'm a veteran, journeyman official. I chose to work junior varsity games for many reasons. If I were to just work my varsity schedule, I would only be working a few nights a week. By choosing to allow my assignment commissioner to assign me junior varsity games, I can be out working games several nights a week, working either varsity, or junior varsity games. It's better than sitting home watching basketball on television. I help out my assignment commissioner by accepting these games. Junior varsity coaches enjoy seeing a veteran official in their games. I like working with young officials, acting as a teacher, and a mentor. I enjoy the game, the kids, my partners, etc.

I also chose to work Catholic middle school games on the weekends, for many of the same reasons.

One of my goals is to be healthy enough when I retire from my day job, in several years, to make myself available to my assignment commissioner to work 3:30 p.m. middle school games, and 4:00 p.m. high school freshman games. Having a veteran, journeyman official in those games can only be a win, win, situation. Good for the players, good for the coaches, good for young, rookie partners, and good for my assignment commissioner. And, of course, good for me.