Thinking about quitting

[Remington]

Originally Posted by CaRef5

those church going hypocrites...f*** em

not srs

well, sorta srs.

Church league misconduct is really a foreign concept to me.........I play in a church league that is very competitive (many former JUCO/college players) and in our league we range in age from 25-45. I have never heard a word from any players or fans in the games. In fact, we call fouls/violations on ourselves if the officials miss one.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Remington

Church league misconduct is really a foreign concept to me.........I play in a church league that is very competitive (many former JUCO/college players) and in our league we range in age from 25-45. I have never heard a word from any players or fans in the games. In fact, we call fouls/violations on ourselves if the officials miss one.

That's great, but from what I can tell your experience is not the norm.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by Remington

Church league misconduct is really a foreign concept to me.........I play in a church league that is very competitive (many former JUCO/college players) and in our league we range in age from 25-45. I have never heard a word from any players or fans in the games. In fact, we call fouls/violations on ourselves if the officials miss one.

This is incredibly rare (unfortunately). I'm not sure why it is exactly (although I have my theories), but on average church leagues and religious schools seem to have more discipline issues than their secular counterparts.

[River Ref]

I concur.............You quit and they win. I would have called the cops too.

[IowaMike]

I did exactly what you are contemplating four years ago. I was working a lot and the last several games of the season were less than pleasant. I worked a jv/varsity boys doubleheader late in the season where we called technicals in both games and had fans yelling insults at us for most of the night. Just a nasty, mean environment. At the end of that season I felt like I'd had enough. I still felt that way the next fall and walked away from officiating. In many ways it was nice to have the free time and I found that the season off did me a lot of good. However, I did start to miss officiating and got the itch again the following season, so I got back into it.

I found that I have a different attitude towards it since I came back three years ago. I work fewer games and don't let a run of bad games get me down too much because I now know that in the long run I would miss the game if I gave it up. Working less has helped me to maintain my level of enjoyment in officiating and the time off a few years ago gave me some good perspective. Some day I know I will give it up completely but I don't think I'm there yet; in general, I still enjoy it 95% of the time; that's a higher percentage of enjoyment than most of the things I do every day.

[Terrapins Fan]

Thanks guys. Your opinions mean a lot. I came here ( and Gary's board ) 11 years ago thinking I knew something about basketball and I knew very little. I learned a lot.

The biggest thing I think anyone can learn here is how to enforce the rules. They aren't cut and dry. I use the Tower Principle a lot ('It is not the intent that the rules shall be interpreted literally, rather they should be applied in relation to the effect which the action of the players has upon their opponents. If they are unfairly affected as a result of a violation of rules, then the transgressor shall be penalized. If there has been no appreciable effect upon the progress of the game, then the game shall not be interrupted. The act should be ignored. It is incidental and not vital. Realistically and practically, no violation has occurred.' Advantage/disadvantage )

I will keep you up to date on my decision. I love officiating ( and I came to it from coaching which made officiating harder to do ). The fans are getting worse. I think we need a Zero Tolerance policy for the fans for insults toward the officials, not sure that's the answer, but it's a start and would send a message.

[Welpe]

You are in good company...I have different reasons for considering not coming back next season but know you aren't alone in your thoughts.

I am not going to make any decisions now but will give myself some down time away from it to make a decision. I certainly recommend doing the same.

I'm positive you will come to the right decision for you.

[26 Year Gap]

Give up the types of games that are the most grief-filled. You will wonder why you didn't do it sooner.

[ref3808]

I hope you stay with it. The game needs good officials, and to my mind anyone who comes here to read, ponder and discuss with others is taking one of the steps toward being one of the best.

I think sufficient rules already exist for governing behavior, be it players, coaches or fans. What's needed is for site administrators to step in earlier and be more proactive in taking care of probem individuals before they become even larger problems. I give a lot of credit to our town AD who at every home game is a visible presence in the gym and takes action when it's required that he do so.

Coaches need to take more seriously that they are resposible for the conduct of their teams. (and I don't mean just their bench during the games) They set the tone and in much the same way as we are told what we don't penalize we condone, the same is true for their programs. Too many players believe participation in athletics is a right, and not something that's earned and requires a consistently high standard of conduct.

[BayStateRef]

No official should be an island. If the league administrators do not fully and completely support you, then do not stay. I work in two leagues that have the potential for trouble: a men's league at a fitness center and a youth travel league.

The management at the fitness center made it crystal clear that there would be no problems supporting any decision we made...even if meant suspending membership. We have an escalating punishment for game disqualifications: two technical fouls (or one flagrant) and you are ejected from that game and you sit out the next game. You may not stay in the gym or try to watch from outside the door. If it happens again, two-game suspension. A third time? You are done for the league season. We have never gone beyond the one-game suspension. The word is out that we mean business...and the idiots either stay away or are quickly told by their teammates to knock if off.

The youth league started having problems a few years back. Since there is no direct site manager, the league developed a policy that the head coaches are responsible for the conduct of their bench and their fans. If we have problems with fans, we tell the coaches to deal with it. If they don't, the game is forfeited. Most parents are thankful that someone is finally telling the jerks to knock it off. I had a problem with a parent after a playoff game last year. When I told the league administrator about it, he told me it was the fourth complaint about that town's teams. The league managers spoke to the town coordinator and gave a simple offer: clean up your act or you will be kicked out of the league.

If I worked in a league that refused to back me fully, I would not work there. But...I would sit down with the managers and let them know the problems. You have a lot of company...and a lot of support from others who have walked in your shoes. If you would like copies of the league policies to share with your folks, send me a private message.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan

Thanks guys. Your opinions mean a lot. I came here ( and Gary's board ) 11 years ago thinking I knew something about basketball and I knew very little. I learned a lot.

The biggest thing I think anyone can learn here is how to enforce the rules. They aren't cut and dry. I use the Tower Principle a lot ('It is not the intent that the rules shall be interpreted literally, rather they should be applied in relation to the effect which the action of the players has upon their opponents. If they are unfairly affected as a result of a violation of rules, then the transgressor shall be penalized. If there has been no appreciable effect upon the progress of the game, then the game shall not be interrupted. The act should be ignored. It is incidental and not vital. Realistically and practically, no violation has occurred.' Advantage/disadvantage )

I will keep you up to date on my decision. I love officiating ( and I came to it from coaching which made officiating harder to do ). The fans are getting worse. I think we need a Zero Tolerance policy for the fans for insults toward the officials, not sure that's the answer, but it's a start and would send a message.

My basic thought: Don't let church/rec league players chase you from the game. Stop doing those games, but keep working the hs circuit.

Maybe inform the league directors why you've chosen to stop working those leagues. Nothing accusing or demanding, just informing them that you've stopped working their games and why.

[dave30]

There is a church in Ft.Worth, TX that no longer has a basketball men's league because no referees will go there anymore! We left in the middle of the last game there........and didn't care about getting paid either! It was worth it to pull off the shirt and whistle and say, "Guys, we're done!"..."Have a nice night!"

[refiator]

My second year of officiating, I was followed about 20 miles after a game...from a redneck area north of Atlanta. I sped up, they sped up, I slowed, they slowed. Never scared, but still eye-opening. I lost them when I git into Atlanta traffic. Made me think, but 22 years later I am still at it, and never again such a problem. It would take a lot more than this for me to give up this passion.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by refiator

My second year of officiating, I was followed about 20 miles after a game...from a redneck area north of Atlanta. I sped up, they sped up, I slowed, they slowed.

Call 911. Drive to a busy public place, or better yet, drive to a police station.

Way back before cell phones, I was followed while on my way to make a night bank deposit from my college restaurant job. I decided to head toward the police station when the follower "lit me up". I guess that I had rolled through a stop sign on my way to the bank. I was so relieved to see the police officer that didn't ticket me after I had explained to him that I was on my way to the police station.

[Maineac]

Originally Posted by Remington

In fact, we call fouls/violations on ourselves if the officials miss one.

Another reason for me to not want to do these games....