Blown 10 second count

[Kelvin green]

In the middle of the first quarter no one is watching the clock to see if your 10 second count is off. However having a 11.7 second backcourt rewards bad offense and does not reward good defense. 10 seconds should be 10 seconds.

At the end of a quarter everyone is watching the clock, we should know it too. If the clock shows 19, I sure as heck try and make sure that it is close. if the clock has tenths of second this is easier than if it does not but if the clock shows 12 and it was 19 I would not be blowing my whistle..

I watched a JV game the other day, there was 27.2 on the clock, clock started correctly. ball was touched in front court at 16.3... No whistle, the team that palyed good defense was screaming and what defense do we have? My count is slow coach so no matter how hard you play Defense I am not going to reward this....Glances and peeks will save a lot...

[letemplay]

I'll say this for you then, you must have some really good eyesight and/or a perfect sightline from where you were sitting in stands, through the player that touched ball in FC, and to the clock on wall. To be able to tell it was touched at the exact time the RUNNING clock showed in tenth's of a second...that's bringin it.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

I watched a JV game the other day, there was 27.2 on the clock, clock started correctly. ball was touched in front court at 16.3... No whistle, the team that palyed good defense was screaming and what defense do we have? My count is slow coach so no matter how hard you play Defense I am not going to reward this....Glances and peeks will save a lot...

I'd say that is within the margin of error expected on a 10 second count when the official count is the officials count. Being off by less than 1 second after 10 seconds is pretty accurate.

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I'd say that is within the margin of error expected on a 10 second count when the official count is the officials count. Being off by less than 1 second after 10 seconds is pretty accurate.

+1 Also, some clock operators do not wait for the chop to start the clock.

[tref]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I'd say that is within the margin of error expected on a 10 second count when the official count is the officials count. Being off by less than 1 second after 10 seconds is pretty accurate.

True, but in an end of quarter situation, how hard is it to subtract 10 from the clock & hit the whistle when you see the magic number?

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Being off by less than 1 second after 10 seconds is pretty accurate.

I'm an analytical chemist. For quality control purposes, when we report a result that's plus, or minus, twenty percent, of another result, we are considered to have duplicated, or replicated, that result. Coming out of academia, I didn't believe this at first, but it's true.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

I'm an analytical chemist. For quality control purposes, when we report a result that's plus, or minus, twenty percent, of another result, we are considered to have duplicated, or replicated, that result. Coming out of academia, I didn't believe this at first, but it's true.

And wtf does that have to do with basketball rules? Last time I looked the 10-second rule didn't say between 8-12 seconds.

[Kelvin green]

Originally Posted by letemplay

I'll say this for you then, you must have some really good eyesight and/or a perfect sightline from where you were sitting in stands, through the player that touched ball in FC, and to the clock on wall. To be able to tell it was touched at the exact time the RUNNING clock showed in tenth's of a second...that's bringin it.

It was after a timeout so clock was stopped. I was standing near the endline so I had the same view...

In most normal situations this accuracy may be good, but at the end of a quarter and 11. 5 seconds run off, how can we say that is accurate? and say no big deal we would not blow the whistle.

If the idea is to get it right this is a situation we have to get right.

Everyone knows we just screwed good defense ... If the official had called the 10 seconds atllets say 17 and it ran to 16.3 and we knew that, would we let that go as well?

[Adam]

"Coach, I've had the same count all game, and by rule, it's my count that matters for this call, not the game clock."

Seems to me that just as foul judgment shouldn't change in the minute, neither should the speed of your ten second count.

[Kelvin green]

and that same count that has been scrwing my defense all night! would be an accurate response...at least from a lot of coaches around here...

The speed of a ten second count should not matter because the rule states 10 seconds and our count should be 10 seconds....it doesnt say the ten second count is what the referee thinks 10 seconds is... it is ten seconds...

Are there times we might be a little slower to call the violation?, just like three seconds or 5 seconds, but telling a coach my count is 11 seconds and that's what we play with is dangerous....

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Last time I looked the 10-second rule didn't say between 8-12 seconds.

If this would be acceptable in a precise, and accurate, field such as analytical science, then I would think that most evaluators would be pleased if an official was able to get it somewhere between 9 and 11 seconds. That would be acceptable to me, especially if the trail official, in a two person game, had a lot of other things to watch. Eight seconds is kind of fast. Twelve seconds is kind of slow. Hitting it on the head at ten seconds, exactly, every single time up the court, seems like a lot to ask.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

And wtf does that have to do with basketball rules?

It's about precision, accuracy, and being able to consistently duplicate a result. In this case, getting as close to ten seconds as humanly possible. How precise, and accurate, do officials, players coaches, and fans, expect us to be? 10.00 seconds every single time? So then how close to 10.00?

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

It was after a timeout so clock was stopped. I was standing near the endline so I had the same view...

In most normal situations this accuracy may be good, but at the end of a quarter and 11. 5 seconds run off, how can we say that is accurate? and say no big deal we would not blow the whistle.

If the idea is to get it right this is a situation we have to get right.

Everyone knows we just screwed good defense ... If the official had called the 10 seconds atllets say 17 and it ran to 16.3 and we knew that, would we let that go as well?

You're assuming that control and touch occur at the same time. It is entirely possible and actually fairly normal that control occurs slightly after the ball is touched. The clock starts on contact, the count starts on control...thus a small amount of time usually passes before the 10 count should start.

10.9 seconds seems to be well within reason.

[tref]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

It's about precision, accuracy, and being able to consistently duplicate a result. In this case, getting as close to ten seconds as humanly possible. How precise, and accurate, do officials, players coaches, and fans, expect us to be? 10.00 seconds every single time? So then how close to 10.00?

10 seconds every time? No, but with the clock stopped in the closing moments of a competitive contest... I don't think thats a tough task for the exceptional official.

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

It was after a timeout so clock was stopped. I was standing near the endline so I had the same view...

In most normal situations this accuracy may be good, but at the end of a quarter and 11. 5 seconds run off, how can we say that is accurate? and say no big deal we would not blow the whistle.

If the idea is to get it right this is a situation we have to get right.

Everyone knows we just screwed good defense ... If the official had called the 10 seconds atllets say 17 and it ran to 16.3 and we knew that, would we let that go as well?

Your first post had the math work out to 10.9 seconds. Just sayin'.