Backcourt violation?

[zeedonk]

Saw this tonight:
Team A advancing the ball from backcourt to frontcourt against pressure. Big man A1 receives pass with left foot in frontcourt and right foot in backcourt. He pivots on left foot, lifting right foot over, but not touching down in frontcourt. He then puts his right foot back down in the backcourt. It didn't look as clumsy as it sounds....

Tweet! Backcourt violation called.

Listened to crew and 2 other ref buddies discuss that play later. Sadly, there were many differing rationales on why it was/was not a violation.

Thoughts?
Z

[JugglingReferee]

A very easy call. A1 was not dribbling, so the "3 points" rules (two feet and ball) does not apply.

Once A1 lifted the foot that was in the BC, he has now established FC status. Putting that foot back to the BC floor is a backcourt violation.

Easy call.

[zeedonk]

Forgot to say what I thought:

I thought it was a backcourt violation. (Not afraid of being wrong, but still don't want to be...)

[APG]

Easy backcourt violation.

What was the rationale of those saying it wasn't a backcourt violation?

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

Easy backcourt violation.

What was the rationale of those saying it wasn't a backcourt violation?

Maybe his body was in the BC "space".

[zeedonk]

2 guys said it was not a violation because all three points were not in the frontcourt. One wondered if it was a travel (thereby granting him instant "honorary coach" status).

It bothered me not because the call was right and somebody else was wrong (Lord knows I'm wrong enough), but because we can't get the call right in a room full of refs after the game-and it's a pretty simple play.

Consistency not only in play calls but rules knowledge has to be better than that in order to be at least minimally competent on the court.... doesn't it?

Z

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by zeedonk

2 guys said it was not a violation because all three points were not in the frontcourt. One wondered if it was a travel (thereby granting him instant "honorary coach" status).

It bothered me not because the call was right and somebody else was wrong (Lord knows I'm wrong enough), but because we can't get the call right in a room full of refs after the game-and it's a pretty simple play.

Consistency not only in play calls but rules knowledge has to be better than that in order to be at least minimally competent on the court.... doesn't it?

Z

You would think so, but I bet the guys you talked to aren't the only ones who don't know how to apply this rule and others correctly.

[APG]

Did no one have a case book around? Pretty sure there's a case book play exactly like this one.

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by zeedonk

It bothered me not because the call was right and somebody else was wrong (Lord knows I'm wrong enough), but because we can't get the call right in a room full of refs after the game-and it's a pretty simple play.

How long have you been visiting this Forum?

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by grunewar

How long have you been visiting this Forum?

Did the ball hit the floor first or not?

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by zeedonk

2 guys said it was not a violation because all three points were not in the frontcourt.

This is the only rationale I'm hearing for not calling a BC violation.

As others have pointed out, this provision of the rule applies only to a dribbler. The player in your case was holding the ball, so when he picked up the foot in the backcourt, he had frontcourt status.

[Loudwhistle2]

Originally Posted by grunewar

how long have you been visiting this forum?

+1:d

[eg-italy]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

A very easy call. A1 was not dribbling, so the "3 points" rules (two feet and ball) does not apply.

Once A1 lifted the foot that was in the BC, he has now established FC status. Putting that foot back to the BC floor is a backcourt violation.

Easy call.

Under NF rules, of course. Not in FIBA. Since you are working with both rule sets I thought it worth noting.

Ciao

[Adam]

Originally Posted by eg-italy

Under NF rules, of course. Not in FIBA. Since you are working with both rule sets I thought it worth noting.

Ciao

Just to clarify, he gets FC status as soon as he touches the FC, right? Therefore, He maintains FC status until he's completely in the BC again?

[eg-italy]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Just to clarify, he gets FC status as soon as he touches the FC, right? Therefore, He maintains FC status until he's completely in the BC again?

FIBA changed the rule this year. Now we consider the ball having FC status when:

(a) the ball is in control of a dribbler and both his/her feet and the ball touch the FC (just the same as in NF, I guess; we already had this), or

(b) the ball in control of a player who is not dribbling and both his/her feet touch the FC, or

(c) the ball is not in control of any player and it touches the FC.

In the OP's case, only one foot of the player in control of the ball touched the FC, so the ball never got FC status. The eight second count does not stop, of course, but that player is allowed to put the other foot again in the BC, maybe start a dribble and return completely in the BC.

Ciao