Warranted T?

[Terrapins Fan]

I had a conversation with a coach once, it went like this.

Me- "you coach, I ref"

Him "But......"

Me - " you coach, I ref"

Him " But you didn't...."

Last time Me- You COACH, I REF"

Him " " Silence, he finally got it.

No problems the rest of the night.

We get rated by the coaches also. I don't think that is fair.

3 years ago, I gave out 20 "T's" 2 years ago 7 Last year 6 and none so far this year. Almost one today, but I passed and it worked out fine ( my partner didn't pass and gave one ) Same game, different situation.

I have the worse coaches rating in my board for a varsity official ( 2.40 , 1.00 would be the perfect but our best is a 1.70) we have classes, I ( the best ) II ( Varsity eligible ) and III. I am a Class I but the coaches kill me.

We have about 50 officials, about 9 are class I's.

[Terrance "TJ"]

Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan

I had a conversation with a coach once, it went like this.

Me- "you coach, I ref"

Him "But......"

Me - " you coach, I ref"

Him " But you didn't...."

Last time Me- You COACH, I REF"

Him " " Silence, he finally got it.

No problems the rest of the night.

Well played.

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan

I had a conversation with a coach once, it went like this.

Me- "you coach, I ref"

Him "But......"

Me - " you coach, I ref"

Him " But you didn't...."

Last time Me- You COACH, I REF"

Him " " Silence, he finally got it.

No problems the rest of the night.

We get rated by the coaches also. I don't think that is fair.

3 years ago, I gave out 20 "T's" 2 years ago 7 Last year 6 and none so far this year. Almost one today, but I passed and it worked out fine ( my partner didn't pass and gave one ) Same game, different situation.

I have the worse coaches rating in my board for a varsity official ( 2.40 , 1.00 would be the perfect but our best is a 1.70) we have classes, I ( the best ) II ( Varsity eligible ) and III. I am a Class I but the coaches kill me.

We have about 50 officials, about 9 are class I's.

This conversation tells me that you are unapproachable. That will stunt your progress at any level past JV Boys. Whether coaches get to directly rate or not, rest assured that coaches talk to each other and to your supervisor. You are fortunate to have that data point, so you can choose to do something about it and help yourself. You need to find a better balance between listening to coaches and managing them. Focus and listening and understanding what they are trying to communicate before you shut them down as a nuisance.

[Adam]

You're reading way too much into a short conversation for which we have no context. There are times when it's appropriate to shut off the "approachable" switch.

You're also missing the final part of his post, where he indicates he's already moved way past JV boys.

[SCalScoreKeeper]

Had a game earlier this year where a GV coach was whining about a non-call.Guy was administering free throws while his lady counterpart was standing table side with the coach who just had a foul called against his team.Coach yells to guy "Be a man and make a call"-Whack from the lady! First tech in a girls game all year!

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

You're reading way too much into a short conversation for which we have no context. There are times when it's appropriate to shut off the "approachable" switch.

You're also missing the final part of his post, where he indicates he's already moved way past JV boys.

He's saying the coaches do not rate him well. There is a reason for that. Officials that are "unapproachable" never prosper, and that label is easy to get and hard to shake, fair or not. The #1 reason officials have moved down the ladder or been dropped from my rosters over the past 15 years is coaches feedback that they are unapproachable, and that is universally true at every level until you are an established D-1 official. Sometimes, coaches need to be dealt with bluntly, given technicals, and even be ejected, but when that happens, it is how we do that which makes the difference. Being approachable and professional in all we do matters. Cutting off a coach like that is generally not a great idea. This is a people business.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

He's saying the coaches do not rate him well. There is a reason for that. Officials that are "unapproachable" never prosper, and that label is easy to get and hard to shake, fair or not. The #1 reason officials have moved down the ladder or been dropped from my rosters over the past 15 years is coaches feedback that they are unapproachable, and that is universally true at every level until you are an established D-1 official. Sometimes, coaches need to be dealt with bluntly, given technicals, and even be ejected, but when that happens, it is how we do that which makes the difference. Being approachable and professional in all we do matters. Cutting off a coach like that is generally not a great idea. This is a people business.

I'm glad coaches have ZERO input into our high school evaluations.

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I'm glad coaches have ZERO input into our high school evaluations.

Not directly, but rest assured they have indirect input, particularly for post-season.

[justacoach]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

Not directly, but rest assured they have indirect input, particularly for post-season.

How do you have any idea how such things operate here in the Old Dominion?
I think you are improperly projecting from the Commonwealth of PA into the Commonwealth of VA. Do you reach that far in your games?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

Not directly, but rest assured they have indirect input, particularly for post-season.

Not even remotely in my area.....none at all.....zip, nada......

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I'm glad coaches have ZERO input into our high school evaluations.

Same here. ZERO input on our assignments.

Originally Posted by TheOracle

Not directly, but rest assured they have indirect input, particularly for post-season.

With all due respect, bull$hit. You have no way of knowing how assignments, whether regular season or post season, are handled everywhere.

I can tell you for sure that they have no input whatsoever here. The assignor books conference tourneys and Sectionals before teams are even seeded. He also selects Regional and State crews and submits them to the state association. Further, local crews only work the first two rounds of the playoffs. Teams see crews from neutral associations for the last 4 rounds.

So while they may have input where you live, that doesn't mean it works that way everywhere.

[Terrapins Fan]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

He's saying the coaches do not rate him well. There is a reason for that. Officials that are "unapproachable" never prosper, and that label is easy to get and hard to shake, fair or not. The #1 reason officials have moved down the ladder or been dropped from my rosters over the past 15 years is coaches feedback that they are unapproachable, and that is universally true at every level until you are an established D-1 official. Sometimes, coaches need to be dealt with bluntly, given technicals, and even be ejected, but when that happens, it is how we do that which makes the difference. Being approachable and professional in all we do matters. Cutting off a coach like that is generally not a great idea. This is a people business.

This is my 11th year. I have been doing Varsity games since year 3. I have been doing play off games since year 3 and I have done post season tournaments.

That coach was either a middle school coach or a freshman coach, he was constantly trying to tell me what I was doing wrong


" that's a reach"

"He walked"

"It's over the back"

I got tired of it.

We had a conversation and he was fine after that.

On the varsity level, I have conversations with coaches as needed but they are rare.

I had one the other night where from 60 feet away the coach knew it was a foul and I am 5 feet from the play.

I explained that there was no way he could see a foul from where he was, when I am 5 feet from the play and I didn't see a foul.

Coach said " that's the problem, you didn't see the foul"

How can you win? The player going to the basket clearly tried to avoid the contact to get his shot off and did.

As for my coaches rating, I believe that the problem is, many of our officials are very friendly with the coaches. I am not. I don't go to the bars after a game and I rarely ever see a coach in public. Many of our officials and coaches do more than 1 sport. I do not.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan

How can you win?

- Answer questions in 10 words or less and then get away from the coach. And there's nothing the matter with a coach having the last word as you're walking away as long as the last words aren't profane, derogatory, etc.
- don't initiate conversations unless you have information to pass
- warn once, not 3 times.
- follow up on all warning
- be approachable but distant at the same time

Works for me. Mileage may vary.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

- Answer questions in 10 words or less and then get away from the coach. And there's nothing the matter with a coach having the last word as you're walking away as long as the last words aren't profane, derogatory, etc.
- don't initiate conversations unless you have information to pass
- warn once, not 3 times.
- follow up on all warning
- be approachable but distant at the same time

Works for me. Mileage may vary.

+1

This part sounds paradoxical. Another way to think about it: be approachable without encouraging the approach.

[Smitty]

Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan

I had one the other night where from 60 feet away the coach knew it was a foul and I am 5 feet from the play.

I explained that there was no way he could see a foul from where he was, when I am 5 feet from the play and I didn't see a foul.

Coach said " that's the problem, you didn't see the foul"

How can you win? The player going to the basket clearly tried to avoid the contact to get his shot off and did.

How about instead of saying this, you say this? That seems like a much more reasonable answer that would (possibly) satisfy the coach.