An Experiment

[fiasco]

Had a game the other week where I had a 5-second call on an in-bounds play. As I was running by the bench, coach said "Felt like your count was a little fast."

So, that night, I went home and did an experiment to time my count. I used a stopwatch, started it, and without looking at it, did a 10-second count.

Come to find out, if anything, my count is too slow, by about a second and a half.

So, last Saturday, I recorded a few college basketball games and used my stopwatch to time a few officials' counts. Some officials were taking two whole seconds to make one count. Almost everyone's counts were too slow.

I did the same at a few high school games that I observed this week. Same result. Most officials take between 1.25 to 2 seconds to make one count.

Try it. Take a stopwatch, start it, do a 10-second count as you would during the game, and stop the stopwatch. Look at the result. Whatcha got??? When I did it, I got 13 seconds.

[grunewar]

When I first started I had a senior official tell me that every now and then when there's no pressure in the backcourt to take a peak at the clock as you're counting to get a feel for what the right timing speed should be. I still do it every now and again and it has helped me keep a pretty steady count. Not that it's perfect of course.....

[bainsey]

You might want to consider the source, Fiasco. That coach is unhappy with losing the ball. His desire to be objective does not equate yours.

Case in point from today: My partner hands the ball to a player for a front-court endline throw-in. The coach continues to shout instructions to that player, who is trying to listen to his coach. Meanwhile, the count goes on, and I'm sensing a five-second violation coming. I'm right. The coach, who was so caught up in his instructions and probably didn't pay attention to the count, exclaims, "that was a pretty fast five seconds!"

Sometimes, not everyone is paying attention to the same things we are.

[TimTaylor]

And if you're going to err, it's best to be on the slow side. It would be pretty embarassing to make a 10 second back court violation call when only 7 or 8 seconds have run off the clock.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by TimTaylor

It would be pretty embarrassing to make a 10 second back court violation call when only 7 or 8 seconds have run off the clock.

About thirty years ago, I did exactly that, yet, I remember it like it was yesterday. Only eight seconds had run off the clock after a made free throw. Coach was so upset that I had to charge him with a technical foul. In discussing it with my partner on the ride home, we figured out that I probably continued a five second throwin count and tacked it onto my ten second count. Apologized to the coach the next time I saw him. This was before we were encouraged to change hands when changing counts.

[shavano]

Just had my son test me on a 10 count backcourt count. 10.05 seconds.

Happy times... Now if I could get that spin move in the post called correctly every time...

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

About thirty years ago, I did exactly that, yet, I remember it like it was yesterday. Only eight seconds had run off the clock after a made free throw. Coach was so upset that I had to charge him with a technical foul. In discussing it with my partner on the ride home, we figured out that I probably continued a five second throwin count and tacked it onto my ten second count. Apologized to the coach the next time I saw him. This was before we were encouraged to change hands when changing counts.

And how do you know the clock was started properly?

[BBrules]

Originally Posted by TimTaylor

And if you're going to err, it's best to be on the slow side. It would be pretty embarassing to make a 10 second back court violation call when only 7 or 8 seconds have run off the clock.

I think this is why you are seeing the slow counts - over -compensation. I have seen this also the last couple of years in both HS and DIII. The worst was an official in a G9 game. The ball was inbounded and the thrower ran on up the court. The girl bringing it up slowly strolled from below the FT line to mid court. Had to have taken 25 seconds and when she hit the division line the official's arm swung for the 4th time. In my view, that gives an unfair advantage to the offense.

[chseagle]

Speaking of a 10-sec. BC Count, during Boys' V tonight, had H inbound from a scoring playing & right before the official could reach ten the HC called a TO. The shot clock read 24 secs. left out of 35. The V HC was complaining after the TO that the 10-sec. BC violation should of been called before the TO as 24 sec. was showing on the shot clock.

The official explained he got to 9 on the BC count before TO was called.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by grunewar

When I first started I had a senior official tell me that every now and then when there's no pressure in the backcourt to take a peak at the clock as you're counting to get a feel for what the right timing speed should be. I still do it every now and again and it has helped me keep a pretty steady count. Not that it's perfect of course.....

Why not just flick the wrist for a minute before the game starts? That way, you can actually pay attention to the game during the game.

[just another ref]

Many years ago, in a boys JH tournament final, team A inbounding under its own basket. Clock reads 7.4 seconds. Big guy for A plants himself right in the middle of the lane calling for the ball. Pass isn't there, ball goes to the wing instead. He holds his position, still calling for it. I call the violation. Coach reacts violently, "What?? We didn't......He didn't......" Then he looks at the clock, and says....not another word.

Clock read 4.2.

[chseagle]

Now I know why a 10-sec. BC usually ends up with the 35-sec. shot clock showing 22-24 seconds.

Originally Posted by fiasco

Had a game the other week where I had a 5-second call on an in-bounds play. As I was running by the bench, coach said "Felt like your count was a little fast."

So, that night, I went home and did an experiment to time my count. I used a stopwatch, started it, and without looking at it, did a 10-second count.

Come to find out, if anything, my count is too slow, by about a second and a half.

So, last Saturday, I recorded a few college basketball games and used my stopwatch to time a few officials' counts. Some officials were taking two whole seconds to make one count. Almost everyone's counts were too slow.

I did the same at a few high school games that I observed this week. Same result. Most officials take between 1.25 to 2 seconds to make one count.

Try it. Take a stopwatch, start it, do a 10-second count as you would during the game, and stop the stopwatch. Look at the result. Whatcha got??? When I did it, I got 13 seconds.

[TimTaylor]

Originally Posted by chseagle

Now I know why a 10-sec. BC usually ends up with the 35-sec. shot clock showing 22-24 seconds.

Not necessarily. When do you start the shot clock?

[chseagle]

As stated by the shot clock instructions

The ball is legally touched by a player inbounds.

Originally Posted by TimTaylor

Not necessarily. When do you start the shot clock?

Anywho, it was meant as a joke hence why the EEK face afterwards.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by chseagle

As stated by the shot clock instructions

The ball is legally touched by a player inbounds.

His point is that the backcourt count starts at a different time than the shot clock.