Any Rule Against This Lame Tactic?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

I wouldn't advise anyone to officiate in fear of the assignor. If you call what you see and what you believe is right, then a good assignor will back you. If you don't receive that support, then you will be better off not working for that person.

But if what you believe is right is actually considered completely and totally wrong by accepted officiating practice, then a good assignor will put your OOO azz into middle school games where you can't further embarrass him or his association.

I'm a good assignor. You might work for me again but it sureashell wouldn't be in a meaningful game if you ever pulled crap like that and insisted you'd do it again under the same circumstances.

There really does exist what is known as the "expected call". And the expected call in this particular case sureashell ain't an unsporting "T".

My personal recommendation is to check with your local rules interpreter before even thinking of following Nevada's advice on this one. That might just save you a future ton of grief.

[bainsey]

The only time I've ever seen this was on a free throw. I had the delayed disconcertion violation, but the free throw was good, so I simply spoke with the kid.

We are instructed here to T up repeated yelling when it's obviously designed to taunt ("dead dead dead"), but it's questionable whether this is applicable in the OP.

Here's a thought. If A-1 goes on an easy breakaway, and Coach B spews profanity along the way, we are supposed to hold the T until after the shot. Let's say, in the OP, the shooter misses the shot. What about using judgment that the yelling caused this miss? (If the shot is good, what's wrong with merely speaking to young yeller?)

By the way, I never bothered to ask this: "OOO?"

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by bainsey

The only time I've ever seen this was on a free throw. I had the delayed disconcertion violation, but the free throw was good, so I simply spoke with the kid.

We are instructed here to T up repeated yelling when it's obviously designed to taunt ("dead dead dead"), but it's questionable whether this is applicable in the OP.

Here's a thought. If A-1 goes on an easy breakaway, and Coach B spews profanity along the way, we are supposed to hold the T until after the shot. Let's say, in the OP, the shooter misses the shot. What about using judgment that the yelling caused this miss? (If the shot is good, what's wrong with merely speaking to young yeller?)

By the way, I never bothered to ask this: "OOO?"

"Dead, dead, dead" is taunting? Not here -- it's notice to the other players to change the defense.

OOO ==> Overly Officious Oaf

On the OP, it would have to be significantly more egregious than I have ever seen or heard of for me to call a T (in the absence of specific instruction from above).

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by bainsey

.

We are instructed here to T up repeated yelling when it's obviously designed to taunt ("dead dead dead"), but it's questionable whether this is applicable in the OP.

Good Lord!!!!

But after seeing some of the rulings issued by your local board interpreter, I gotta say that I ain't really surprised. Amazed? Yup. But not surprised.

Lah me....

That particular tactic, while it might be personally irritating, is accepted as being just that....only personally irritating. It is one helluva stretch to call it unsporting.

But if it'll make you feel any better, Nevada is proud of your interpreter for standing up for Truth, Justice and the American Way.

Lah.....me....

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Amazed? Yup. But not surprised.

Reminds me of a joke:

Daniel Webster is sitting in his home office and has his secretary on his lap. His wife walks in, sees the situation, and declares, "Daniel! I'm surprised!"

Webster replies, "No, my dear, it is I who am surprised. You are astonished!"

Be here all week.

[ref2coach]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Lah me....

Lah.....me....

JR I have wondered for a while what "Lah me" means. I just looked it up in the online urban dictionary.

Here is the definition:
Arabic for meat. Without lahme no one can live because lahme is the best creation in za universe if the lahme not exist zen i will just curse.

This does not seem to fit. A little help please.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by bainsey

...
We are instructed here to T up repeated yelling when it's obviously designed to taunt ("dead dead dead"), but it's questionable whether this is applicable in the OP.

...

If you are really paying attention while you officiate you would notice the "dead, dead, dead" yell means that the ball-handler no longer can dribble the ball.

[bainsey]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

If you are really paying attention while you officiate you would notice the "dead, dead, dead" yell means that the ball-handler no longer can dribble the ball.

Yes, we know that. The question, as I've been told, is whether the defender is communicating with his team, or taunting his opponent. Why say "dead" more than twice? What's his purpose?

Truthfully, I see "dead dead dead" or "ball ball ball" very rarely in these parts. I believe word has gotten out that can be a T, so the coaches and players have adapted.

Simply put, when in Rome. If you guys do something differently elsewhere, then fine. Adapt to the world in which you are. The ultimate need for your basketball community is that everyone is on the same page where you live and serve. I may not agree with some of the things I'm taught, but I'll follow through on the instructions, as the bigger picture is consistency in the locale. I'm not so arrogant that I believe that my way is the only way to call a game.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by bainsey

Yes, we know that. The question, as I've been told, is whether the defender is communicating with his team, or taunting his opponent. Why say "dead" more than twice? What's his purpose?

The idea is that they say "dead" as long as the ball holder does not have a dribble. It's communication, and it also keeps the team engaged.

That said, we don't see it much around here. That may be because oxygen is at a premium here, though.

I saw it with some of the better girls programs in Iowa. Of course, I also saw some of the lesser programs just be annoying with it; not really understanding the purpose.

I've can't recall seeing a boys team do it.

[APG]

Originally Posted by bainsey

Yes, we know that. The question, as I've been told, is whether the defender is communicating with his team, or taunting his opponent. Why say "dead" more than twice? What's his purpose?

You say it multiple times to make sure everyone on the team has heard the status of the ball. I really can't believe this to be taunting in any way. Do we think someone on Team B is gonna deck Team A because they told each other that a player can't dribble the ball? When in Rome I suppose but this really baffles me.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

You say it multiple times to make sure everyone on the team has heard the status of the ball. I really can't believe this to be taunting in any way. Do we think someone on Team B is gonna deck Team A because they told each other that a player can't dribble the ball? When in Rome I suppose but this really baffles me.

+1 on all counts.

[VaTerp]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

+1 on all counts.

I often hear players say "dead, dead, dead" when the opponent has picked up the dribble at high levels of boys and girls ball. And when I coached we would teach players to do this.

As others have said, it is simple communication with teamates and how to defend accordingly. You repeat it to make sure everyone hears you and to let them know the ball is still "dead."

How this could be interpreted as taunting is beyond me. And IMO it's short-sighted interpretations like this that help give officiating a bad rep in some people's eyes.

[jeffpea]

Originally Posted by bainsey

Yes, we know that. The question, as I've been told, is whether the defender is communicating with his team, or taunting his opponent. Why say "dead" more than twice? What's his purpose?

"dead, dead, dead" is NOT taunting in my book...."na, na, na, na, na, naaahhhh - you can't dribble anymore; you can't dribble anymore! hey everybody look - it's Mr. 'I can't dribble anymore'..." now THAT is taunting.

IF a partner of mine called a T for "taunting" or "unsportsmanlike behavior" in this situation, you can be sure that I will be conducting some serious taunting of said official in the locker room after the game...

[Adam]

Originally Posted by jeffpea

"dead, dead, dead" is NOT taunting in my book...."na, na, na, na, na, naaahhhh - you can't dribble anymore; you can't dribble anymore! hey everybody look - it's Mr. 'I can't dribble anymore'..." now THAT is taunting.

IF a partner of mine called a T for "taunting" or "unsportsmanlike behavior" in this situation, you can be sure that I will be conducting some serious taunting of said official in the locker room after the game...

Now that's funny.

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Now that's funny.

Yep. You don't want to be 'that guy'.