Any Rule Against This Lame Tactic?

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by bainsey

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We are instructed here to T up repeated yelling when it's obviously designed to taunt ("dead dead dead"), but it's questionable whether this is applicable in the OP.

...

If you are really paying attention while you officiate you would notice the "dead, dead, dead" yell means that the ball-handler no longer can dribble the ball.

[bainsey]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

If you are really paying attention while you officiate you would notice the "dead, dead, dead" yell means that the ball-handler no longer can dribble the ball.

Yes, we know that. The question, as I've been told, is whether the defender is communicating with his team, or taunting his opponent. Why say "dead" more than twice? What's his purpose?

Truthfully, I see "dead dead dead" or "ball ball ball" very rarely in these parts. I believe word has gotten out that can be a T, so the coaches and players have adapted.

Simply put, when in Rome. If you guys do something differently elsewhere, then fine. Adapt to the world in which you are. The ultimate need for your basketball community is that everyone is on the same page where you live and serve. I may not agree with some of the things I'm taught, but I'll follow through on the instructions, as the bigger picture is consistency in the locale. I'm not so arrogant that I believe that my way is the only way to call a game.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by bainsey

Yes, we know that. The question, as I've been told, is whether the defender is communicating with his team, or taunting his opponent. Why say "dead" more than twice? What's his purpose?

The idea is that they say "dead" as long as the ball holder does not have a dribble. It's communication, and it also keeps the team engaged.

That said, we don't see it much around here. That may be because oxygen is at a premium here, though.

I saw it with some of the better girls programs in Iowa. Of course, I also saw some of the lesser programs just be annoying with it; not really understanding the purpose.

I've can't recall seeing a boys team do it.

[APG]

Originally Posted by bainsey

Yes, we know that. The question, as I've been told, is whether the defender is communicating with his team, or taunting his opponent. Why say "dead" more than twice? What's his purpose?

You say it multiple times to make sure everyone on the team has heard the status of the ball. I really can't believe this to be taunting in any way. Do we think someone on Team B is gonna deck Team A because they told each other that a player can't dribble the ball? When in Rome I suppose but this really baffles me.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

You say it multiple times to make sure everyone on the team has heard the status of the ball. I really can't believe this to be taunting in any way. Do we think someone on Team B is gonna deck Team A because they told each other that a player can't dribble the ball? When in Rome I suppose but this really baffles me.

+1 on all counts.

[VaTerp]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

+1 on all counts.

I often hear players say "dead, dead, dead" when the opponent has picked up the dribble at high levels of boys and girls ball. And when I coached we would teach players to do this.

As others have said, it is simple communication with teamates and how to defend accordingly. You repeat it to make sure everyone hears you and to let them know the ball is still "dead."

How this could be interpreted as taunting is beyond me. And IMO it's short-sighted interpretations like this that help give officiating a bad rep in some people's eyes.

[jeffpea]

Originally Posted by bainsey

Yes, we know that. The question, as I've been told, is whether the defender is communicating with his team, or taunting his opponent. Why say "dead" more than twice? What's his purpose?

"dead, dead, dead" is NOT taunting in my book...."na, na, na, na, na, naaahhhh - you can't dribble anymore; you can't dribble anymore! hey everybody look - it's Mr. 'I can't dribble anymore'..." now THAT is taunting.

IF a partner of mine called a T for "taunting" or "unsportsmanlike behavior" in this situation, you can be sure that I will be conducting some serious taunting of said official in the locker room after the game...

[Adam]

Originally Posted by jeffpea

"dead, dead, dead" is NOT taunting in my book...."na, na, na, na, na, naaahhhh - you can't dribble anymore; you can't dribble anymore! hey everybody look - it's Mr. 'I can't dribble anymore'..." now THAT is taunting.

IF a partner of mine called a T for "taunting" or "unsportsmanlike behavior" in this situation, you can be sure that I will be conducting some serious taunting of said official in the locker room after the game...

Now that's funny.

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Now that's funny.

Yep. You don't want to be 'that guy'.

[JRutledge]

And Jeffpea "tries" to taunt me often, but I would not want to be on the end of this barrage of comments if I ever called this one.

Peace

[johnny1784]

Originally Posted by jeffpea

"dead, dead, dead" is NOT taunting in my book...."na, na, na, na, na, naaahhhh - you can't dribble anymore; you can't dribble anymore! hey everybody look - it's Mr. 'I can't dribble anymore'..." now THAT is taunting.

IF a partner of mine called a T for "taunting" or "unsportsmanlike behavior" in this situation, you can be sure that I will be conducting some serious taunting of said official in the locker room after the game...

It is possible to be taunting in this situation. It depends on how the word(s) is used towards another opponent.

A1 repeatedly yells "ball, ball, ball” at B1 who does not have the ball. I can understand A1 being warned and if the unsporting act continues, receiving a player technical foul.

What is the purpose of yelling at the opponent? Is this in the spirit of the game? Are the words used inappropriately?

This action by team A could cause retaliation by players on team B, leading to possible flagrant acts and fights.

NFHS Rule 10-2-6c

It is rare but I have seen similar actions by teams or a player, to use gestures or words to intimidate an opponent.

Verbal and physical tactics are very difficult to detect. E.g., A1 slightly tugs at B1’s jersey during a shot attempt and B1 misses the shot. Is this a foul or a no call or hold your whistle if shot goes in?

The players are getting real good at staying under the radar preventing from being seen or showing that you as a ref should not make a “ticky tack” call on players using 2 fingers slightly tugging an opponents jersey.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by johnny1784

It is possible to be taunting in this situation. It depends on how the word(s) is used towards another opponent.

A1 repeatedly yells "ball, ball, ball” at B1 who does not have the ball. I can understand A1 being warned and if the unsporting act continues, receiving a player technical foul.

What is the purpose of yelling at the opponent? Is this in the spirit of the game? Are the words used inappropriately?

This action by team A could cause retaliation by players on team B, leading to possible flagrant acts and fights.

NFHS Rule 10-2-6c

It is rare but I have seen similar actions by teams or a player, to use gestures or words to intimidate an opponent.

Verbal and physical tactics are very difficult to detect. E.g., A1 slightly tugs at B1’s jersey during a shot attempt and B1 misses the shot. Is this a foul or a no call or hold your whistle if shot goes in?

The players are getting real good at staying under the radar preventing from being seen or showing that you as a ref should not make a “ticky tack” call on players using 2 fingers slightly tugging an opponents jersey.

OOO imo.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

If you are really paying attention while you officiate you would notice the "dead, dead, dead" yell means that the ball-handler no longer can dribble the ball.

I say this to myself so I can remember that the dribble has been used up. I have terrible memory sometimes.

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by Welpe

I say this to myself so I can remember that the dribble has been used up. I have terrible memory sometimes.

Just don't say it too loudly.