shooting FT's when in bonus

[hawkeyegb]

Someone spell it out clearly when there is an offensive foul and you go to the other end to shoot the bonus. I believe it is when there is no team control but not sure...this one gets me all the time.

[mbyron]

Probably the idea of an "offensive foul" is messing you up. You're right, if you have a player control or team control foul, no FT's.

Typically you'd shoot FT's for a common foul by the "offense" during rebounding action, when there is no team control.

[hawkeyegb]

so charge/illegal screens or anytime the offensive team has the ball and a pers foul is called on the offense we are not shooting at the other end?

[VaTerp]

Originally Posted by hawkeyegb

so charge/illegal screens or anytime the offensive team has the ball and a pers foul is called on the offense we are not shooting at the other end?

Correct

[Back In The Saddle]

That is correct. If the foul is committed by the player in control of the ball (a player-control foul) or by a player of the team in control of the ball (a team-control foul), we do not shoot free throws.

"The ball is awarded out of bounds after:...A player-control or team-control foul, as in 7-5-4a" (NFHS 7-4-5)

It's also important to note that, like mbyron said, during rebounding action there is no team control. So a foul by any member of the "shooting team" could result in free throws. Under NFHS rules the same is true during a throw-in, a foul by any member of the throwing team could result in free throws.

[bainsey]

It all comes down to the concept of control, Hawkeye. That is, team and/or player control. The best way to look at this is to understand the concept of control:

Team control BEGINS when a player holds or dribbles a live ball inbounds, or secures a jump ball with at least one foot on the floor. Obviously, player control exists when a player has control.

Player/team control ENDS when the ball is released on a try/tap for goal, an opponent controls the ball, or the ball is dead. If the ball is loose, team control still exists (obviously by the last team that controlled it), unless there was a try for goal.

And yes, whenever there is a player control or team control foul, there are no free throws. If the non-controlling team fouls, or there's no team control at all, free throws can happen.

[Adam]

Throw-ins.

[Camron Rust]

Such an "Offensive Foul" can occur between the time the ball is at the disposal of a thrower and when player control is obtained (by catching or dribbling the ball inbounds, not just touching the ball). Any such foul would result in FT's if the bonus is in effect.

Another type of "Offensive" foul that could result in bonus FTs is one that occurs after the release of a shot but before the shot is made/ball is dead or before the ball is controlled on a rebound...such as might occur when players are fighting for rebounding position.

[tref]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Another type of "Offensive" foul that could result in bonus FTs is one that occurs after the release of a shot but before the shot is made/ball is dead or before the ball is controlled on a rebound...such as might occur when players are fighting for rebounding position.

Too bad we cant use the loose ball mechanic in that sitch

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by tref

Too bad we cant use the loose ball mechanic in that sitch

Sure you can. Just say "no control" when reporting the foul. Serves the exact same informatory purpose imo.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by hawkeyegb

Someone spell it out clearly when there is an offensive foul and you go to the other end to shoot the bonus. I believe it is when there is no team control but not sure...this one gets me all the time.

1) Remember that there are no Offensive Fouls in the NFHS, NCAA Men's/Women's, and FIBA rules codes.

2) Rember that there are Offensive Fouls in the NBA/WNBA rules codes.

3) All personal fouls in the NFHS, NCAA Men's/Women's, and FIBA rules codes are committed by a A1 when: (a) A1's team is in control of the ball, or (b) A1's team is not in control of the ball (either Team B has control of the ball or neither team has control of the ball).

MTD, Sr.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

...All personal fouls in the NFHS, NCAA Men's/Women's, and FIBA rules codes are committed by a A1...

I'll try reporting all my fouls that way in my game today.

"Red, A1, push." or "White, A1, block."

Should make for an interesting evening.

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Throw-ins.

In NFHS, there is no team control in those situations. So, technically, there is no offense until a throw-in is completed. Thus, there would be shots if the inbounding team fouled prior to the throw-in being completed if the other team was in the bonus.

[Back In The Saddle]

I think that was what he was implying, he was just uncharacteristically terse. He must've been in a hurry to get lunch.

BTW, there is no definition of "offense", and more particularly no rule that tells us who is on offense and when. That is what makes the term "offensive foul" so meaningless in an NFHS or NCAA rules context. Based purely on my understanding of the "general usage" of the word, I would say that the throwing team during a throw-in is "on offense." But, obviously, they do not have team control.

[26 Year Gap]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

I think that was what he was implying, he was just uncharacteristically terse. He must've been in a hurry to get lunch.

BTW, there is no definition of "offense", and more particularly no rule that tells us who is on offense and when. That is what makes the term "offensive foul" so meaningless in an NFHS or NCAA rules context. Based purely on my understanding of the "general usage" of the word, I would say that the throwing team during a throw-in is "on offense." But, obviously, they do not have team control.

I was just being an agitator. My guess is that he just saw someone drive by in a pyrite-colored Scion and he got distracted.