You Can Ring My Bell ...

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

The player must be directed to leave the game. So, a sub is needed. You can't grant the TO until the sub is in the game. The removed player can't return until the clock has properly started.

Sounds good, but, citation please. I don't see anything here (below) about sitting a tick, but I've been known to be wrong in the past. Also, at our local board's interpretation meeting last night we were told that such a player could continue to play if he was cleared by a health care professional during a timeout. But that's just our little corner of Connecticut.

3-3-8: Any player who exhibits signs, symptoms or behaviors consistent
with a concussion (such as loss of consciousness, headache, dizziness,
confusion, or balance problems) shall be immediately removed from the game
and shall not return to play until cleared by an appropriate health care
professional.

[Jurassic Referee]

There's 3 new case book plays on player injuries this year.

3.3.6SitA, B, & C.

Read 'em.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

3.3.6SitA, B, & C.

These appear to be about "regular", that is, non concussive, injuries. Are you saying that these case plays also apply to concussions, assuming that in all cases a health care professional clears such players?

*3.3.6 SITUATION A: A1 is injured and play is stopped to permit the athletic
trainer or physician to administer aid. (a) A1 is removed from the court and
replaced within less than one minute; or (b) the injury is such that the physician
will not allow A1 to be removed from the court until being certain it is prudent to
do so. After approximately five minutes, A1 is moved from the court. RULING: No
time-out is charged in either (a) or (b), regardless of the amount of time involved.
The intent of the rule is to require an injured player to be removed without charging
a team with a 60-second time-out, regardless of how much time is consumed
prior to removal. A team may call a time-out if they wish to keep the player (if
able) in the game provided the replacement interval for the substitution has not
began. (5-8-2a)

*3.3.6 SITUATION B: A1 appears to be injured and an official properly halts
play and the Team A coach rushes onto the court to check A1. However, A1 is OK
and seems ready to play within a few seconds. RULING: A1 must be removed as
the coach came onto the court. A1 may remain in the game if the coach does not
come on the court and A1 is ready to play immediately. If the coach or other
bench personnel have come onto the court, the player must be replaced. There is
no set amount of time as to what is “immed iately,” but it should not involve more
than a few seconds and it must be without the coach, athletic trainer or doctor
being beckoned and/or entering the court. The coach may also call a time-out to
keep the player in the game provided the replacement interval for the substitution
has not began. (10-4-2)

*3.3.6 SITUATION C: A1 is injured and bench personnel are beckoned onto the
court. Once A1 has been removed from the court, the official notifies Team A’s
head coach that a replacement is required. The coach acknowledges the notification
and the official then instructs the timer to begin the 20-second replacement
interval because a substitute is not made available immediately. Team A’s head
coach then requests a time-out to keep A1 in the game. RULING: The time-out
request must be made when the official informs the coach that a replacement is
required. Once the 20-second interval has begun and A1’s replacement is pending,
a time-out shall not be granted. Once A1 is replaced by a substitute, Team A
may request and be granted a time-out, if desired. (2-12-5 Note; 3-3-6 Note 2;
5-8-3b)

[BktBallRef]

Our state supervisor of officials told us he sits a tick.

So, he sits a tick.

[Anchor]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Our state supervisor of officials told us he sits a tick.

So, he sits a tick.

Yeah, he did--in no uncertain terms!

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Sounds good, but, citation please.

5-8-3b

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

5-8-3b

Grants a player’s/head coach’s oral or visual request for a time-out, such request being granted only when: b. The ball is dead, unless replacement of a disqualified, or injured player(s), or a player directed to leave the game is pending, and a substitute(s) is available and required.

I understand that we don't grant a time out if there is a disqualified player until he, or she, is replaced. Probably the same thing with an untucked jersey (by the book). But in the case of an injured player (not a concussion, let's say a twisted ankle), or a bleeding player, aren't we allowed to grant a time out to the coach to keep that player in the game, if the injury can be dealt with, or the bleeding can be stopped, in the time frame of a time out. If what I say is true, what rule covers that?

[Multiple Sports]

BM - Was at the IAABO convention and Alan Goldberger said specifically to insist on a medical doctor that is willing to clear the player for his return to the game.

You might want to give Jeff Clark a ring / e-mail and ask him.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Multiple Sports

BM - Was at the IAABO convention and Alan Goldberger said specifically to insist on a medical doctor that is willing to clear the player for his return to the game.

Unfortunately, that is not supported by the new rule. In fact, the reference to an MD (and to a written authorization to RTP) was actually removed in the rule. The NFHS specifically says that the "approved medical personnel" will depend on each state's laws and regulations. So each state will need to tell its officials who is approved to decide if the player can return to the game. The state might mandate a doctor, but they might not. They might say the trainer at the game is approved to make the decision. If that person says the kid is not concussed, then by rule, he can come back into the game.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Multiple Sports

Health Care Professional ?

According to Connecticut Public Act 10-62, An Act Concerning Student Athletes And Concussions, a Health Care Professional (HCP) is defined as: a Physician, a Physician's Assistant, an Advanced Practice Registered Nurse, or an Athletic Trainer trained in the evaluation and management of concussions.

[BayStateRef]

Originally Posted by Multiple Sports

BM - Was at the IAABO convention and Alan Goldberger said specifically to insist on a medical doctor that is willing to clear the player for his return to the game.

There is a lengthy discussion of this (written by Goldberger, who is a lawyer) in the current IAABO newsletter. He does not say it must be a doctor. Instead, he quotes the rule and says officials must know what their state association determines to be "appropriate health-care professionals" which could be medical doctors, osteopathic physicians, and certified athletic trainers.

He offers this rather common sense advice:

At the end of the day, officials continue to be “empowered” to remove players, but need not obtain written credentials of the health-care professional on the sidelines.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Grants a player’s/head coach’s oral or visual request for a time-out, such request being granted only when: b. The ball is dead, unless replacement of a disqualified, or injured player(s), or a player directed to leave the game is pending, and a substitute(s) is available and required.

I understand that we don't grant a time out if there is a disqualified player until he, or she, is replaced. Probably the same thing with an untucked jersey (by the book). But in the case of an injured player (not a concussion, let's say a twisted ankle), or a bleeding player, aren't we allowed to grant a time out to the coach to keep that player in the game, if the injury can be dealt with, or the bleeding can be stopped, in the time frame of a time out. If what I say is true, what rule covers that?

In your OP, the coach didn't have any TOs left. He was trying to keep the player in the game by not going on the court. Not allowed for any injury (unless, the player is ready to play "immediately" and it's not for concussion symptoms).

If you change the situation, you change the outcome.