Leg Tap

[Judtech]

For my own edification, could I ask for some clarification:

Player A1 is going up for a jump shot...
1. B1 places their hand directly in the face of the shooter
2. B1 attempts to block the shot and in the course of that attempt their hand
ends up directly in front of the shooters face
3. Prior to the shot attempt, A1 is in "triple threat", B1 closes out with a hand in A1 face and keeps it there as A1 attempts their shot.

All legal? I am actually seeing this type of 'defensive' move more and would like to make sure I am on top of the correct rulings and schools of thought.
IMO: (which is chiseled in yogart)
1. Non basketball play. The shooter goes from a clear field of vision to that vision being purposefully obstructed in a non basketball way.
2. Clearly a basketball play
3. Could go either way. Depends on what the 'divined' intent of the defender is. Did the hand intentionally go to A1's face? Is B1 just staying on their feet defensively and their hand and the shooters face end up at the exact same height off the floor.
These are the plays I have seen this spring and any of the afore mentioned thoughts are more than open to change.

[Jurassic Referee]

Has anyone ever seen anyone call a "T" on a defender for putting a hand in a shooter's face in an NCAA D1 game? Ever? In a high school varsity game? In any game?

Has anyone ever heard of that particular call having been made in an NCAA D1 game? State final? Whatever?

I haven't.

Would you make that call in a college camp this summer?

[Pantherdreams]

I was at a tournament last summer the game my first game was part of a back to back for a local club team u16. Coach was hot and looking for clarification during warmup. In the previous game the had lost by 6 his kids had been called for 7 unsportsmanlike and 1 tech.

3 - For putting and hand up and/ yelling shot at the shooter.
2 - For full front denying players with their back to the ball that the official interpreted as face guarding.
2- For blocking calls made on defenders before the ball was inbounded.

(Tech was on coach for complaining about the unsportsmanlikes.)

COach wanted to know why his kids weren't allowed to play defense. They reality was the first game officials probably called some by the book stuff that was misinterpreted (officials from all over no just guys i knew).

Though in the same tournament 2 u19 teams combined for 15 unsportsmanlikes most of those were legitimate excessive contact or breaking up the fast break.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Has anyone ever seen anyone call a "T" on a defender for putting a hand in a shooter's face in an NCAA D1 game? Ever? In a high school varsity game? In any game?

Has anyone ever heard of that particular call having been made in an NCAA D1 game? State final? Whatever?

I haven't.

Would you make that call in a college camp this summer?

Have you ever seen a T called for this anywhere on the court in anything above a high school JV game?
This whole discussion is hypothetical. The only time I've ever even seen a defender do it to a player without the ball was in a 6th grade girls YMCA game.

JR, the rule says nothing about a shooter, but if you say the POE exempts the shooter from the protection this rule provides, so be it. I'm trying to make sure I understand this correctly, because it seems as if you're saying the POE adds a caveat to the rule.

Situations:
1. A1 with the ball at the top of the key, has used his dribble and is now holding the ball looking to pass. B1 reaches up and puts his hands over A1's eyes, the obvious purpose of the move is to obstruct the vision of A1 rather than actually play defense.

2. Same situation as #1, but A1 decides to shoot just as B1's hands get near his A1's eyes. Again, B1 isn't even attempting to play defense, he's just obstructing A1's vision.

Are you saying that the POE tells us that #2 is not a T because A1 is shooting? I think it says the defense can challenge the shooter just as always, but cannot stick their hand in the shooter's face for the sole purpose of obstructing his vision.

Granted, the bar on this is so high that it should probably never get called.

[bainsey]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I think it says the defense can challenge the shooter just as always, but cannot stick their hand in the shooter's face for the sole purpose of obstructing his vision.

That's exactly how I'm reading it.

When you guard the shooter with a hand up, often times, vision will be blocked. A hand in the face isn't necessarily a hand over the eyes. If the clear intent is to block vision -- an unsporting foul -- that's where the T comes in.

For fun, let's take it a step further. A1 has the ball. B2 is directly behind A1 and facing him. B2 reaches around A1's head and covers both eyes with both hands while making contact above the nose (almost like playing "guess who?"). Since contact was made on a live ball, can this only be a personal foul, or does the technical take precedence, due to the obvious intent?

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by bainsey

Since contact was made on a live ball, can this only be a personal foul, or does the technical take precedence, due to the obvious intent?

No If you did choose to make the call for obstruction of vision, it would be for the obstruction of vision, not for the contact, which would be considered incidental to the play.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by bainsey

That's exactly how I'm reading it.

When you guard the shooter with a hand up, often times, vision will be blocked. A hand in the face isn't necessarily a hand over the eyes. If the clear intent is to block vision -- an unsporting foul -- that's where the T comes in.

Agree.

They didn't change the rule (and it was NOT an editorial clarification) so for nothing.

[APG]

As far as I know, NFHS, NCAA, and NBA all have rules against face guarding in certain situations. In every venture of basketball I have watched (and especially since I started officiating), I have never, ever seen this considered this face guarding or had an evaluator say anything to the fact.

NCAA Men's wording:

Section 6. (Men) CLASS B TECHNICAL INFRACTIONS
Art. 1. A technical foul shall be assessed to a player or a substitute for the
following infractions:

a. Purposely obstructing an opponent’s vision by waving or placing
hand(s) near his eyes.

NCAA women's is vary similar. I believe the NFHS wording as been posted already (at least the philosophy and how the rule is to be interpreted).

The NBA wording is a lot more specific:

m. Eye guarding (placing a hand in front of the opponent’s eyes when guarding from the rear) a player who does not have possession of the ball is illegal and an unsportsmanlike technical shall be assessed.

For as long as I was playing basketball, it's been taught that it's good defense to place a hand in the shooter's face to challenge the shot. I feel that we have (or might already), see this happen more cause Shane Battier, a SG/SF who is an excellent defender has use this tactic with varying success when guarding Kobe Bryant. In fact, I know the TV announcers have made it a point to say how instead of trying to block the shot, Battier would but a hand up in the face to challenge the shot. There would never be contact though would be times where it would be close. No one every made a fuss about it.

[Judtech]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Has anyone ever seen anyone call a "T" on a defender for putting a hand in a shooter's face in an NCAA D1 game? Ever? In a high school varsity game? In any game?

Has anyone ever heard of that particular call having been made in an NCAA D1 game? State final? Whatever?

I haven't.

Would you make that call in a college camp this summer?

I saw this called at the state tournament this year and twice in the regular season HS (both girls games.) On the collegiate level, I know an official had a discrete discussion with a coach and player about the practice and the advisability of discontinuing it.
I can't recall seeing it more than a few times in the past couple of years, but for some reason I am seeing more of it this spring. I have been handling by simply saying to the coach or player "Not for nothing but did you know if a player puts their hands in the face of an opponent for the sole purpose of blocking their vision is a "T"?" That has usually taken care of it. I think this is different than the leg tap play b/c there is no contact and I think you can get away with warning and avoid adding what some may think as crap into the game. Again, just my semi solid opinion!