B1 deflect a A1 pass, ball go backcourt

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by mendi

The ball is in team A control and they start to move from their backourt. the ball is in team B FC (team A BC). A1 try to pass to A2. B1 is in team B FC and he deflect the ball and the ball goes to team B BC. B2 touch the ball BC. violation?

B1 was the last to touch (deflect) FC
B2 was the first to touch BC.

But what about control? deflection (slap the ball with one hand) is control?

The deflection was not (as described) team control. Team control starts when there's first player control. Player control starts when a player is holding or dribbling the ball inbounds.

(The above is FED / NCAA. FIBA might be different.)

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

The deflection was not (as described) team control. Team control starts when there's first player control. Player control starts when a player is holding or dribbling the ball inbounds.

(The above is FED / NCAA. FIBA might be different.)

Bob - I'm sure you meant a live ball inbounds. Sorry. I'm just feeling nit-picky today.

[Pantherdreams]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

The deflection was not (as described) team control. Team control starts when there's first player control. Player control starts when a player is holding or dribbling the ball inbounds.

(The above is FED / NCAA. FIBA might be different.)

FIBA that's back court . . .

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Pantherdreams

FIBA that's back court . . .

Really? Team control with FC status isn't required? Other FIBA officials concur?

[APG]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Really? Team control with FC status isn't required? Other FIBA officials concur?

Not a FIBA official but from their ruble book:

Art. 14 Control of the ball
14.1 Team control starts when a player of that team is in control of a live ball because he is holding or dribbling it or has a live ball at his disposal.

10.2 The ball becomes live when:
• During the jump ball, the ball is legally tapped by a jumper.
• During a free throw, the ball is at the disposal of the free-throw shooter.
• During a throw-in, the ball is at the disposal of the player taking the throw-in.

Art. 30 Ball returned to the backcourt
30.1 Definition
30.1.1 The ball goes into a team's backcourt when:
• It touches the backcourt.
• It touches a player or an official who has part of his body in contact with the backcourt.

30.1.2 The ball has been illegally returned to the backcourt when a player of the team in control of the live ball is:

• The last to touch the ball in his frontcourt, after which that player or a teammate is the first to touch the ball in the backcourt.
• The last to touch the ball in his backcourt, after which the ball touches the frontcourt and then is first touched by that player or team-mate in the
backcourt.

This restriction applies to all situations in a team's frontcourt, including throw-ins. However, it does not apply to a player who jumps from his frontcourt, establishes new team control while still airborne and then lands in his team’s backcourt.

30.2 Rule
A player whose team is in control of a live ball may not cause the ball to be illegally returned to his backcourt.

[Adam]

Interesting, it's worded differently (providing situations where a violation in NFHS would not be a violation in FIBA), but it appears this particular situation (the OP) would not be a violation in FIBA.

[bas2456]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

Not a FIBA official but from their ruble book:

Aha...Haha. I see what you did there.

[APG]

Originally Posted by bas2456

Aha...Haha. I see what you did there.

Totally unintentional hahaha

[Pantherdreams]

Maybe misunderstood the op.

B1 touches the ball in B1's front court (A Backcourt) tipping it into B's back court into the hands of B2 in B's backcourt.


I think the issue that hanging me up here is whether the ball has established team control for B in B's front court. I understand that holding or dribbling may not have occurred but as I'm envisioning it would now totally depend on timing, intent and actually seeing the play. I may be splitting hairs but in a world of tip passing, knock down dribbles, one hand passes, drop passes and players being allowed to tip the ball up the length of the floor to themselves without dribbling what constitutes a pass, dribble, deflection, tip, or pass gets grey. If I player can tip the ball to himself or a teammate I would say his team is in control despite it not being a hold or dribble.

Now if he just deflected a pass and it ended up being picked up by a teammate in the ensuing scramble to back court thats one thing, if he's popping the ball out into the hands of waiting teammate that smacks of pass. I can see situations where I would call backcourt and not call it having re-read the op. I think of changing language of picks up/goes to, deflection, one hand slap, etc ,etc I may not be envisioning this the same way as others.

To sum up if it is just a deflection or stray ball that happens to be picked up by a teammate then no. If they player is "tipping" or slapping the ball away to a teammate I'm calling backcourt.

I just worked through a lot of stuff there in my head and writing it out. I'll shut up now.