Similar to Welpe's situation

[representing]

Didn't want to hijack Welpe's thread so I wanted to start a new one regarding something similar.

Boy's JV match last year. I don't remember all the details, but this is what I remember.

I called a foul on a player, I don't remember against who or for what. as I'm walking to the table, he comes up to my side and bumps me with his chest. Now, I'm not sure if it was intentional or not, but I think he said something like "c'mon, he was pushing me" and might have been just demonstrating how he was being pushed or something. That took me by surprise, and the statement that Welpe had said, "surprise is an umpire's worst enemy comes to mind" definitely came to play here (which is what triggered me to make this post). I did keep my composure and continued as if nothing happened, mainly because at the time I wasn't really registering that little chest bump.

Got to the table, and finds out it was his 5th. At that time I started to register that he had just chest bumped me about 10 seconds earlier. I debated about giving him a T or flagrant, but didn't know how to complete it because it was his 5th foul prior to this incident. I forgot at what point a player becomes benched when it is his 5th foul, and didn't want to wrongfully give the coach an indirect. Read later that a fouled-out player doesn't become bench until you notify the coach and player that it is the 5th foul and then start the 20 seconds count.

Thoughts?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by representing

Didn't want to hijack Welpe's thread so I wanted to start a new one regarding something similar.

Boy's JV match last year. I don't remember all the details, but this is what I remember.

I called a foul on a player, I don't remember against who or for what. as I'm walking to the table, he comes up to my side and bumps me with his chest. Now, I'm not sure if it was intentional or not, but I think he said something like "c'mon, he was pushing me" and might have been just demonstrating how he was being pushed or something. That took me by surprise, and the statement that Welpe had said, "surprise is an umpire's worst enemy comes to mind" definitely came to play here (which is what triggered me to make this post). I did keep my composure and continued as if nothing happened, mainly because at the time I wasn't really registering that little chest bump.

Got to the table, and finds out it was his 5th. At that time I started to register that he had just chest bumped me about 10 seconds earlier. I debated about giving him a T or flagrant, but didn't know how to complete it because it was his 5th foul prior to this incident. I forgot at what point a player becomes benched when it is his 5th foul, and didn't want to wrongfully give the coach an indirect. Read later that a fouled-out player doesn't become bench until you notify the coach and player that it is the 5th foul and then start the 20 seconds count.

Thoughts?

No, he becomes bench personnel after you notify the coach. That's why the order is coach, clock, player. 4-14-2 if you care.

[Smitty]

My thought is that you should read a rule book. Has nothing to do with your post, but that is my thought and you asked.

[representing]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

No, he becomes bench personnel after you notify the coach. That's why the order is coach, clock, player. 4-14-2 if you care.

Honestly, when I was typing that, I was thinking "wait, i got this wrong". Yes, it is after the coach is notified. Thank you for correcting me.

[representing]

Originally Posted by Smitty

My thought is that you should read a rule book. Has nothing to do with your post, but that is my thought and you asked.

Thanks, but I do so regularly. But thanks.

[RookieDude]

A few thoughts:

1) Smitty is correct....really get to know the rules.

2) You were correct in not calling something you did not know how to administer.
(See first thought)

3) For me, it doesn't matter WHAT the player says...it's HOW the player says it! It is unsporting, IMO, to come up to you and "chest bump" or get in your face or whatever that player did...WHACK! (..and then refer to thought one again)

4) Another thought...keep posting your situations...it not only helps you learn, but others that are reading these posts as well.

[Smitty]

Originally Posted by representing

Thanks, but I do so regularly. But thanks.

Your arrogance notwithstanding, you need to read it until you understand it.

[tomegun]

So this kid bumped you and you didn't do anything? OK, I think you should keep posting your situations, but listen when you are given advice - read the rule book. Your question should have been about recording a flagrant foul after a 5th foul, but before you report it (5th foul) to the table.

[representing]

Originally Posted by tomegun

So this kid bumped you and you didn't do anything? OK, I think you should keep posting your situations, but listen when you are given advice - read the rule book. Your question should have been about recording a flagrant foul after a 5th foul, but before you report it (5th foul) to the table.

Yes, I know I was wrong. It was in close game and the excitement was high for everyone. I just couldn't wait for the game to be over and when this happened, it didn't register immediately. When I was reporting to the table, I was actually thinking "is it too late to give that technical to him for the chest bump?". I don't mean late as in I couldn't give it because I know I could've given it up next play started. What I meant by "too late" is how it would make me look if I gave him a T like 5-10 seconds after it had happened.

It was my mistake, I was just caught by surprised, it wasn't registering in my brain at the moment it happened, and I second-guessed myself. Happens to all of us.

[archangel]

Originally Posted by Smitty

My thought is that you should read a rule book. Has nothing to do with your post, but that is my thought and you asked.

Seems to me that any of us who visit this site, and post questions, realizes that rule book reading is a must.
I also believe that no-one here knows all the rules 100%. If there were no rule questions/concerns about a situation, this valuable/interesting site would be non-existent.
Lastly, I sometimes guess that posters like to add to their post count, and I'm not talking about me...

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by representing

It was in close game and the excitement was high for everyone. I just couldn't wait for the game to be over...

I know this might sound harsh, but maybe officiating isn't for you. What I'm hearing (actually reading) is an official who 1) possibly got caught up in the emotion of the game and 2) an official who possibly compromised the game because he or she was ready to go home. I come to that conclusion from your words above.

I have called a T with .6 on the clock before and it was well deserved. How much time remained didn't matter one bit.

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by archangel

Lastly, I sometimes guess that posters like to add to their post count, and I'm not talking about me...

Of course they do. To some, post count equates to knowledge.

[representing]

Originally Posted by tomegun

I know this might sound harsh, but maybe officiating isn't for you. What I'm hearing (actually reading) is an official who 1) possibly got caught up in the emotion of the game and 2) an official who possibly compromised the game because he or she was ready to go home. I come to that conclusion from your words above.

I have called a T with .6 on the clock before and it was well deserved. How much time remained didn't matter one bit.

How dare you?! You don't even ****ing know me. I had one bad game last year, that was it. Officiating is my primary job right now, I don't do anything else. It is one of the things I love to do the most.

You say time doesn't matter, neither does it matter to me. if there's .01 second left on a clock and a coach says something to me, I'll T him up even if he's down by 50!

That's it, end of discussion, I'm done for now. I got a game tonight and will be back on afterward if anything unusual comes up.

[representing]

Originally Posted by archangel

Lastly, I sometimes guess that posters like to add to their post count, and I'm not talking about me...

I couldn't care less about post counts. It only bothers me when someone thinks they own the forum and I look to see they've been on this site for several years and only have like 200 posts.

[chartrusepengui]

apparently this was one of the bad ones