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Old Thu Dec 10, 2009, 11:27am
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Foul on Free Throw

Both teams have 8 fouls. Player A1 is shooting a 1-and-1. A1 makes the first shot, and after the ball goes through, player A2 fouls B2 on the lane while attempting to go for a potential rebound. The referee counts the basket and calls a foul on A2.

Now what? Does A1 get to shoot the second free-throw or does B2 go and shoot a 1-and-1 or both or what?
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Old Thu Dec 10, 2009, 11:32am
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First of all, there shouldn't be a common foul in that situation if the contact occurred after the ball passed through the basket. It was a dead ball. Ignore the contact unless it was intentional or flagrant.

That said, if the foul occurred before the ball passed through the basket, then A1 would get the second of his free throws with the lane cleared (since the ball will remain dead after the attempt), then go to the other end and B2 attempts his FT(s) with players on the lane.
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Old Thu Dec 10, 2009, 11:37am
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What exactly, and when?

Quote:
Originally Posted by brainbrian View Post
Both teams have 8 fouls. Player A1 is shooting a 1-and-1. A1 makes the first shot, and after the ball goes through, player A2 fouls B2 on the lane while attempting to go for a potential rebound. The referee counts the basket and calls a foul on A2.

Now what? Does A1 get to shoot the second free-throw or does B2 go and shoot a 1-and-1 or both or what?
If the foul occurred AFTER the ball passed through, you have dead-ball contact and should rule accordingly (ignore/assess).

If the foul occurred DURING live-ball play, you have a foul on A2... bonus free-throws for the other team.
Fouls are dealt with in the order that they occur.
Clear lane for A1 to attempt 2nd FT, then go to other end and resume play with B2 attempting 1 and 1.

If you determined the foul to have happened AFTER the ball passed through and was dead AND that the contact could not be ignored, you have a player technical on A2. Finish up with A1 with lane cleared, go to the other end. Attempt technical foul free throws (any player or eligible substitute), then Team B ball for throw-in opposite the table at the division line.
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Old Thu Dec 10, 2009, 11:46am
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It was during an NCAA game, so the players can leave their space on the release. The foul was while getting position for the potential rebound, but the referee said after the ball went in to still count the bucket. That being said, to clarify, I don't think there should have been a dead ball technical called.

The referees then talked for a good length of time between themselves and both coaches, and then decided to give B2 a 1-and-1 and not not allow A2 her second shot. So this was incorrect?
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Old Thu Dec 10, 2009, 11:50am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brainbrian View Post
It was during an NCAA game, so the players can leave their space on the release. The foul was while getting position for the potential rebound, but the referee said after the ball went in to still count the bucket. That being said, to clarify, I don't think there should have been a dead ball technical called.

The referees then talked for a good length of time between themselves and both coaches, and then decided to give B2 a 1-and-1 and not not allow A2 her second shot. So this was incorrect?
Not necessary, and an NCAA ref should know better. Now, if he said "after the release," that's different.

The question isn't what the official said, however; it's what actually happened. From your clarification, it seems as if the foul happened after the release but before the ball went in.

A2 should have been given her second shot.
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Old Thu Dec 10, 2009, 12:28pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brainbrian View Post
but the referee said after the ball went in to still count the bucket.
I'm confused.

Did the referee say this after the ball went in? Or did the referee say the foul happened after the ball went in?
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Old Thu Dec 10, 2009, 01:36pm
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Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
Did the referee say this after the ball went in? Or did the referee say the foul happened after the ball went in?
I was not watching the play close enough to say exactly when the foul happened. The referee counted the free throw though.
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Old Thu Dec 10, 2009, 01:54pm
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Originally Posted by brainbrian View Post
I was not watching the play close enough to say exactly when the foul happened. The referee counted the free throw though.
My questions:
1. Did the referee say it the foul was after the release or after the ball went through the basket?
2. How do you know why he said it?

The FT should have counted if the foul happened after the release.
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Old Thu Dec 10, 2009, 02:18pm
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My question is more wondering if A1 gets to shoot her second free throw or not.
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Old Thu Dec 10, 2009, 02:47pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brainbrian View Post
My question is more wondering if A1 gets to shoot her second free throw or not.
Once A1 is awarded FTs, the only way they are not shot is if the clock has expired and the FTs will have no bearing on determining the winner.

So, yes, A1 should have shot the second FT.
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Old Thu Dec 10, 2009, 03:28pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brainbrian View Post
My question is more wondering if A1 gets to shoot her second free throw or not.
Ahem!
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Originally Posted by Snaqwells View Post
Not necessary, and an NCAA ref should know better. Now, if he said "after the release," that's different.

The question isn't what the official said, however; it's what actually happened. From your clarification, it seems as if the foul happened after the release but before the ball went in.

A2 should have been given her second shot.
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Old Thu Dec 10, 2009, 03:49pm
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To be totally pedantic...

* If the foul occurred before the release, the ball is dead immediately and no free throw can be scored. Report the foul, clear the lane, the shooter will re-shoot the free throw that was interrupted, and if made will shoot the "and 1". Then go shoot for the new foul.
* If the foul occurred after the release, but before the ball goes through the basket, the ball remains live until the try ends, count the basket. Report the foul, clear the lane, the shooter gets the second free throw. Then go shoot for the new foul.
* If the foul occurred after the ball passed through the basket, the ball is dead and unless the contact is deemed intentional or flagrant it is ignored.

In all cases the original free throw shooter is entitled to shoot all of the free throws that were originally awarded.
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