HS vs. College

Is it me or does it seems like at the HS level, officials tend to get too caught up PCAs vs. Ball watching. There is a difference, isn’t there??

When working with college officials, I find that their mindset is, to referee their PCA to the best of their ability while seeing as much of the court as possible. Their focus is more on seeing secondary defenders, expanding their PCA when there’s no competitive match-up. Quick whistles on RSBQ plays vs. a patient whistle on plays to the bucket & allowing the player to finish. Knowing that more contact is sure to occur the closer a player gets to the basket, but learning how to sort out whats marginal vs. a foul. They also, might ask why you didn’t have a double whistle when they made a call in the grey area.

Some HS officials, that I know (especially those who don’t attend camps) think it’s ball watching when you double down with them. They want to have the only whistle on the play. I’ve noticed when a partner doesn’t open up to accept the play at L & the contact isn’t marginal, if you wait a sec or two before coming with a whistle, they will get upset & say they were passing on it. But the entire gym including grandma up in the bleachers saw it.

Most of the time you can forget about being like-minded on RSBQ, possession consequence, knowing the impact of your whistle, etc.

Has anybody else noticed some of these differences in the officials mindset from HS to college? Or is it just the particular individuals & not their level of experience?

How do you handle incorporating the things your college buddies teach you with your HS partners without ruffling feathers?

[JRutledge]

I think people that have worked college basketball tend to have had to attend more camps and are trained not to do certain things. I do not think it is much more complicated than that. Because if you ball watched at a college camp, you would be called out rather quickly for doing such a thing.

If I am talking to high school officials about things, I do not mention anything about college ball unless it is completely relevant to the discussion. For example if someone is trying to bring a college mechanic to the high school level, but it does not apply to the high school level. Other than that, I do not even go there because people think you are trying to make them feel less then.

Peace

I hear you & did not intend for the post to put anybody down, for I am just a mere HS official with aspirations & dreams.

It's just difficult to work on preparing for camps with people who aren't on the same page. Kinda makes for an inconsistent game. ie; once a player gathers the ball, I'm putting them on the line while others say great job getting to the cup, now take the ball out & start over.

But I understand, basically control what you can control...

[bradfordwilkins]

Are you a member of Ed Rush's Court Club Ch1Town? I think you'd really enjoy it if you're not.

[btaylor64]

I would almost guarantee he is part of the court club because the terminology and phrases he is using are rarely if ever used at college camps and I've been to a good amount of those! Quick whistle on RSBQ vs. Patient whistles on drives??? Yeah def. Ed Rush stuff. That's great! I encourage more people to become part of the court club.

Sorry to say it and people can just say I'm bias but most of the things you are speaking of when you say "college" is pro stuff. In my personal opinion, plays to the hoop, in college, need to have more whistles. I believe there are too many plays that involve a lot of illegal contact and yet it goes uncalled for reasons I have tried to understand and yet don't. Granted I don't work big time D1, yes I work some D1 but not big time, so I'm not there and don't get it. Its just good to see that John Adams recognizes that there is indeed a problem cause he is wanting officials to up their play calling to 80 percent! That seems crazy to me. I think it should be higher but once again i don't know how bad it was but apparently it was bad to him. The greatest in the world call in the mid 90s

[Zoochy]

What are RSBQ plays? Also, what is the 'Ed Rush's Court Club?'

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by btaylor64

most of the things you are speaking of when you say "college" is pro stuff. In my personal opinion, plays to the hoop, in college, need to have more whistles.

I wish you guys would make up your minds. For years (I'd say 5 years), the buzzword at "pro" camps that I attended was "cheap and-1s". There was a HUGE value placed on holding your whistle on any play going to the basket and let it finish without a whistle unless the contact caused the try to miss.

I haven't been to a pro-philosophy camp in the last two years, so perhaps that emphasis has changed. If so, all I can say is, thank goodness.

John Adams recognizes that there is indeed a problem cause he is wanting officials to up their play calling to 80 percent! That seems crazy to me. I think it should be higher

I said this at the beginning of the season when the 70% figure was stated for last year's NCAA tournament: I simply don't believe it. There's no way that the BEST 90 officials in the country miss 3 out of every 10 calls/no-calls. Either the evaluation method was flawed, or the people evaluating the tape were looking to make a point.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

I hear you & did not intend for the post to put anybody down, for I am just a mere HS official with aspirations & dreams.

It's just difficult to work on preparing for camps with people who aren't on the same page. Kinda makes for an inconsistent game. ie; once a player gathers the ball, I'm putting them on the line while others say great job getting to the cup, now take the ball out & start over.

But I understand, basically control what you can control...

All you can do is call your game. Stop worrying about what others do or call. If they are not calling what they are supposed to, it will be exposed. This is how people get advanced all the time. Just do your job and let the chips fall where they may.

Peace

Gotcha JRut, thanks.

bradfordwilkins - So you have made that investment too? I really do enjoy year-round mentoring/coaching... best thing that has happened for my game.

[Brad]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

All you can do is call your game. Stop worrying about what others do or call.

Almost 14K posts and this is possibly the greatest thing you have ever said.

You can retire from the forum now!

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Brad

Almost 14K posts and this is possibly the greatest thing you have ever said.

You can retire from the forum now!

I might just do that, and it would not for what I said in this thread.

Peace

[dbking]

Originally Posted by Brad

Almost 14K posts and this is possibly the greatest thing you have ever said.

You can retire from the forum now!

I believe that this philosophy can only take you so far.

There are three teams on the court for every game. In 3 person crews, this philosophy can kill the game. A good solid pre game and follow up at time outs will bring the consistency that is required to have a quality game. That inconsistency is what drives coaches and fans crazy.

Be in proper position to see the whole play. Be patient with your whistle. Call the obvious and protect the shooter are great basics. However, the great crews are the ones that have similar calls on similar plays on both ends of the court. The players and coaches can adjust to that. We take the bad rap when we do not do that.

BE THE BEST TEAM ON THE COURT!

[IREFU2]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I think people that have worked college basketball tend to have had to attend more camps and are trained not to do certain things. I do not think it is much more complicated than that. Because if you ball watched at a college camp, you would be called out rather quickly for doing such a thing.

If I am talking to high school officials about things, I do not mention anything about college ball unless it is completely relevant to the discussion. For example if someone is trying to bring a college mechanic to the high school level, but it does not apply to the high school level. Other than that, I do not even go there because people think you are trying to make them feel less then.

Peace

Agreed, just be a good partner and call your game.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

How do you handle incorporating the things your college buddies teach you with your HS partners without ruffling feathers?

You don't. You incorporate it into your game.