players with 4 fouls

[beachbum]

I would bet that most officials can reflect back at calls made in their games and think that there were some that, if the given the chance to go back, would not make that same call.

that is what I would call a cheep or questionable call.

So, when talking about a players 5th foul, If in reflecting back you think,"gosh i wish I would have held my whistle on that one", that is what this discussion is about.

If the guy hammers someone going up for a basket, it's a no brainer, give him his 5th. But in knowing a player has 4 and see him do something questionable, and then giving the 5th!!!

If the same ref gave all of the fouls in a game, then you would have consistency, but since we rotate, each official is going to view a play differently. If you think that statement is not true, think about the times your partner has called a foul and you wondered what he saw that you didn't.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by beachbum

I would bet that most officials can reflect back at calls made in their games and think that there were some that, if the given the chance to go back, would not make that same call.

that is what I would call a cheep or questionable call.

So, when talking about a players 5th foul, If in reflecting back you think,"gosh i wish I would have held my whistle on that one", that is what this discussion is about.

If the guy hammers someone going up for a basket, it's a no brainer, give him his 5th. But in knowing a player has 4 and see him do something questionable, and then giving the 5th!!!

You shouldn't even give the player his first on this. If it's just questionable, it's legal.

Originally Posted by beachbum

If the same ref gave all of the fouls in a game, then you would have consistency, but since we rotate, each official is going to view a play differently. If you think that statement is not true, think about the times your partner has called a foul and you wondered what he saw that you didn't.

You really should make it a point not to make foul calls unless you see what happened. If you don't see it, don't call it.

That said, everyone makes that call now and then; but I would hope you don't make them every game. I'd much rather look back and think, "I should have had a whistle there."

Personally, I think everyone should make every foul call as if it might be the player's fifth. Those that think the fifth should be an extra careful call will learn to call every foul like that, and those that make every call carefully won't have to change a thing.

[deecee]

Any type of "whatever management" that is not explicity covered in the rule books just falls under officials preferences. Each method has its followers and each side swears their way is better and the other way is not as optimal. Then we argue over how each person wants to run a game as if its our place to say.

The rule book allows for anything not covered in the rule book to be at our discretion. People feel comfortable doing it one way over another fine. Until someone who has authority over them (their association) tells them to do otherwise its just opinion. If some guys want to coach, let them, its their choice and their responsibility. Who are any of you to tell them what to do and then get so worked up when they reject your opinion.

As officials sometimes we think to much about the game an not about the job. Get on the floor make your calls, and when you are done leave. No one outside of our circle really gives a damn that we are there, and they are not there to watch us. If some guys feel comfortable officiating players rather than the game, then let them. Its their choice and their career. Its also their region and their territory.

I do think that there are differences between officials that are greater than just personal preference. I think region, and association play as a big a part in how we officiate from one area to another when it comes to certain items. But what I have learned from experience is what a lot of "experienced" officals say about reffing, that sounds so good its as if they are on a pulpit, and what they actually do when they are officiating a game is like night and day. Then again I had one such "experienced" official tell me that me and my partner looked sloppy because one of us had pleated pants and the other didnt (this was during my 6th year). When he started to give some more feedback I just got up and left. I appreciated any feedback and help that is useful and will make me a better official, but sometimes I do feel like the "experienced" officials just like to hear themselves talk.