Odd Looking Play in Duke Game

[Spence]

Duke big man has the ball at top of key. Duke guard coming to get the ball behind the big man but he's being pressured by Purdue defender. He stops to try to get away from his defender. Duke big man thinks he's coming behind him and "drops" the ball to the floor. Duke big man then realizes the Duke guard is not there and picks it up.

Would the "drop" constitute a dribble? He didn't push it or tap it. He literally (intentionally) dropped it. He had not used his dribble prior to this pass/drop.

Anything?

[fiasco]

Not to hijack your thread, but I noticed another strange play in the game. Purdue guard in the corner jumps for a shot, Duke player flies in for the block. Purdue guard pushes the ball to the floor in mid air, lands, then dribbles.

No call.

[Spence]

Originally Posted by fiasco

Not to hijack your thread, but I noticed another strange play in the game. Purdue guard in the corner jumps for a shot, Duke player flies in for the block. Purdue guard pushes the ball to the floor in mid air, lands, then dribbles.

No call.

I saw that one as well. Sometimes even the top guys miss the obvious ones.

[fiasco]

Originally Posted by Spence

I saw that one as well. Sometimes even the top guys miss the obvious ones.

True true! Not that mistakes are acceptable, but it sure makes me feel better about myself!

[Coltdoggs]

Originally Posted by fiasco

Not to hijack your thread, but I noticed another strange play in the game. Purdue guard in the corner jumps for a shot, Duke player flies in for the block. Purdue guard pushes the ball to the floor in mid air, lands, then dribbles.

No call.

I missed one of these in a Jr High game last weekend! I guess I missed it....but I bet I won't again!

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Spence

Duke big man has the ball at top of key. Duke guard coming to get the ball behind the big man but he's being pressured by Purdue defender. He stops to try to get away from his defender. Duke big man thinks he's coming behind him and "drops" the ball to the floor. Duke big man then realizes the Duke guard is not there and picks it up.

Would the "drop" constitute a dribble? He didn't push it or tap it. He literally (intentionally) dropped it. He had not used his dribble prior to this pass/drop.

Anything?

Consider it a dribble, it's exactly why I say a ball does not have to be pushed, batted, or thrown to the floor to start a dribble. It can also be dropped.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Consider it a dribble, it's exactly why I say a ball does not have to be pushed, batted, or thrown to the floor to start a dribble. It can also be dropped.

I would agree. Tentatively. I wonder what "interesting" side-effects such a change to the definition would create.

[AKOFL]

so B1 is recieving a pass on the run. It is a little out of reach. so he reaches out and swats it out of the air to the floor then procedes to pic it up and start his dribble. Is this double dribble?

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by AKOFL

so B1 is recieving a pass on the run. It is a little out of reach. so he reaches out and swats it out of the air to the floor then procedes to pic it up and start his dribble. Is this double dribble?

It's a judgment call. If you judge that B1 was in control of the ball when he swatted it out of the air, and thus began a dribble, then yes. If you judge that the swat was part of his attempt to gain control of the ball, then no. IMHO, if it's not obviously the first case, assume the second.

[AKOFL]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

It's a judgment call. If you judge that B1 was in control of the ball when he swatted it out of the air, and thus began a dribble, then yes. If you judge that the swat was part of his attempt to gain control of the ball, then no. IMHO, if it's not obviously the first case, assume the second.

I'm new. What's IMHO. U don't want to know what I think it is.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by AKOFL

so B1 is recieving a pass on the run. It is a little out of reach. so he reaches out and swats it out of the air to the floor then procedes to pic it up and start his dribble. Is this double dribble?

NO!! NO!! NO!! NO!! NO!! NO!! NO!! NO!! NO!! NO!!


With apologies to the late J. Dallas Shirley, always give the benefit of the doubt to the player when he is trying to gain control of the ball in this situation. I am not saying that it is not possible for a player to gain control of the ball through the action of swatting of the ball as you describe, but the probablity of it is very, very, very, very small.

MTD, Sr.


P.S. AKOFL: My emphasis was not specifically intended for you but for the coaches and officials who lurk in the shadows of this Forum and will rule this an illegal dribble everytime. This year at the OhioHSAA State Rules Meetings this exact play was shown to everybody. It occured during the State Finals a few years ago and was ruled an illegal dribble. What made it worse was the State Rules Interpreter at the meeting at which I saw the tape thought it was the correct call.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

I would agree. Tentatively. I wonder what "interesting" side-effects such a change to the definition would create.

Mainly player control. Wait, maybe not. You can't drop it until you've had control. Never mind.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Mainly player control. Wait, maybe not. You can't drop it until you've had control. Never mind.

There may be some muddiness about whether a player who "abandons" the ball by dropping it and walking away has actually begun a dribble. And it would seem to invite all the same arguments about whether it's a dribble before it's touched the second time.

Could it introduce any confusion about whether an action was a fumble, or because of the changed definition, a dribble?

[Johnny Ringo]

Originally Posted by Spence

Duke big man has the ball at top of key. Duke guard coming to get the ball behind the big man but he's being pressured by Purdue defender. He stops to try to get away from his defender. Duke big man thinks he's coming behind him and "drops" the ball to the floor. Duke big man then realizes the Duke guard is not there and picks it up.

Would the "drop" constitute a dribble? He didn't push it or tap it. He literally (intentionally) dropped it. He had not used his dribble prior to this pass/drop.

Anything?

Assuming that the Duke big man had already dribble and this was said to be legal since dropping the ball can be considered the start of a dribble?

But, what if the Duke big man had already killed his dribble ... Could he pick it up then?

[Coltdoggs]

Originally Posted by Johnny Ringo

Assuming that the Duke big man had already dribble and this was said to be legal since dropping the ball can be considered the start of a dribble?

But, what if the Duke big man had already killed his dribble ... Could he pick it up then?

Did he fumble it?