What's the call in this instance.....

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by jeffpea

imo, can't have a "no call" here....the contact affected the play causing the ball to go out of bounds. gotta have something!

based on what you've described, I'm probably calling a blocking foul. sounds like the defender established legal gaurding position, but did not move to maintain LGP as the offensive player moved. block!

if you don't like the block call, then ask yourself this....did the offensive player create/gain an advantage as the result of his contact w/ the defender? (because that is basically what a charge/offensive foul is, right?...)

HUH????

A defender is NEVER REQUIRED to move to maintain LGP. They have the option of remaining stationary. If they are stationary, they don't need LGP. Any contact with a stationary defender who initially obtained that spot legally can never be a block. It doesn't matter where the contact occurs (torso, side, or elsewhere). If the offensive player wishes to change directions to avoid contact, it is their responsibility to do so. A defender who is legally in a spot has no requirement to get out of the way when the contact will not be sqaure on the torso.

Any advantage lost by the offense was their own fault.

The only calls that are valid are PC or OOB....I'm calling OOB.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

HUH????

A defender is NEVER REQUIRED to move to maintain LGP.

LOL, thanks Camron. I was thinking "How can I call a foul on a guy for NOT moving?"

Any advantage lost by the offense was their own fault.

The only calls that are valid are PC or OOB....I'm calling OOB.

Agree.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

LOL, thanks Camron. I was thinking "How can I call a foul on a guy for NOT moving?"

What if one of the defender's feet was OOB?

Aw, c'mon, you knew I had to ask.

Before anyone actually answers this, be sure to read every page of:
Block / Charge Situation

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

What if one of the defender's feet was OOB?

Aw, c'mon, you knew I had to ask.

We've got a rope
We've got a tree
All we need is a
Referee.

And you just volunteered.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

We've got a rope
We've got a tree
All we need is a
Referee.

And you just volunteered.

I kinda felt like doing some swingin' tonight.

Hey, wait a minute...

[zebra44]

I have a no call. The way I view it, there is a difference between tripping and being tripped. JMHO.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by zebra44

There is a difference between tripping, and being tripped.

Rookie officials, please make a note of this statement. Easy to understand, simple, and a pretty good interpretation.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

What if one of the defender's feet was OOB?

Aw, c'mon, you knew I had to ask.

Before anyone actually answers this, be sure to read every page of:
Block / Charge Situation

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

We've got a rope
We've got a tree
All we need is a
Referee.

And you just volunteered.

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

I kinda felt like doing some swingin' tonight.

Hey, wait a minute...

Sheesh! I have my first game of the season (first game since early January), and you guys go and have fun like this? I'm shocked!

BTW, I'm sticking with a no-call followed by an OOB call.

[amusedofficial]

Geez. After months of lurking I actually had to register on this one, to ask two questions.

1. What rule refers to "the cylinder that each person is entitled to" This sounds like ESPN-speak.

2. Similiarly, I am unable to find "the rule that says if the contact is not in the torso area of the defender the defender is at fault"

Kind of eerie that a site that regularly posts "misunderstood rules" would see postings from people who should know better inventing rules that aren't in the book. But then perhaps the "torso rule" and the "cylinder rule" are on the same page as "reach" and "over the back" fouls, and I haven't gotten to that page yet.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by amusedofficial

Geez. After months of lurking I actually had to register on this one, to ask two questions.

1. What rule refers to "the cylinder that each person is entitled to" This sounds like ESPN-speak.

2. Similiarly, I am unable to find "the rule that says if the contact is not in the torso area of the defender the defender is at fault"

1. Not a rule, a concept. BITS quotes the basis from 4-23; a player does not have legal position if his foot is extended, his arm is extended, etc, no matter how long he's held it there. It's just like if B1 had been standing in the lane with his arms held out straight to the sides since February; if A1 comes in and tries to run by B1 only to catch an arm in the neck, it's a foul on B1 no matter how long he's held the pose.
2. Not a rule, but a rule of thumb; not applicable to a stationary defender who is standing in a legal position. Completely applicable (as a rule of thumb) to a moving defender with LGP; and definitely the rule if a the contact is with an extended limb.

[OHBBREF]

Originally Posted by amusedofficial

1. What rule refers to "the cylinder that each person is entitled to" This sounds like ESPN-speak.

the terminology is pretty bad but the referece IMO would be toward "the principle of verticality"


Also everyone seems to be missing the obvious: WHO INITIATED THE CONTACT?

Even if the contact is torso to torso, it doesn't have to be PC if the Defender moved to the offensive player, or if the offensive player bowls over a defender who is not stationary it doesn't have to be a block.

The player initiating the contact is the one held liable in most cases.

I got nothing on this contact - whistle the ball OOB and we go the other way.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

What if one of the defender's feet was OOB?

Aw, c'mon, you knew I had to ask.

Before anyone actually answers this, be sure to read every page of:
Block / Charge Situation

I don't know if I can handle an 18 page discussion after all of the A-11 craziness in the football forum.