Please help clarify - 'half step' rule

[pistol]

Well regardless, that's where it came from. Somebody started this post not me!! It was like that for years and since they only changed the rules every 4 years and JAy R says it was different in 2000 well maybe that's when it happened.
Sorry I took the time to explain Juraccic!!!

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

1) I firmly believe that one of the reasons that an "obvious travel" gets missed at a higher level may because it wasn't that obvious.

Some are more obvious than others. My son started pointing out uncalled traveling violations when he was 8 years old.

2) How many travel calls are you going to call a night. If you are a purist AND and called exactly by the rules, bring your sleeping bag because you'll be there all night ( how bout a blown whistle every time down the floor) There are lots of travels we dont call each game. We miss a lot of them because it might have looked like a good basketball move, or we did call it because it was out of place and player got an advantage...

How many is too many? Does this mean you call a certain percentage or if there are only a few you do call them all or......what?

3) If you are reffing the NBA finals a Kobe's got an uncontested dunk,.... Hey all those fans did not pay to hear you blow the whistle...

We hear this all the time. It doesn't fly with me. Kobe is arguably the best player in the world at this time. If he doesn't know how to dunk without committing a violation, he needs to just lay it up.

[eg-italy]

Originally Posted by pistol

Well regardless, that's where it came from. Somebody started this post not me!! It was like that for years and since they only changed the rules every 4 years and JAy R says it was different in 2000 well maybe that's when it happened.
Sorry I took the time to explain Juraccic!!!

The rule changed in 1996 (or was it 1998? It doesn't matter much, I guess). After twelve (or ten) years, there's still people convinced that the rule still is the old one; among them there are also officials

Ciao

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

3) If you are reffing the NBA finals a Kobe's got an uncontested dunk,.... Hey all those fans did not pay to hear you blow the whistle...

Unfortunately, that'd true....and that's exactly why the NBE is such a joke today......and if you do any reading, it's also why the NBE seems to have about zero credibility left when it comes to it's officiating philosophies. Nobody, and I mean nobody, can seem to come up with any idea of what a travel or a foul actually is anymore.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

Here some of my thoughts on this.

1) I firmly believe that one of the reasons that an "obvious travel" gets missed at a higher level may becaue it wasn't that obvious. If you are in a game with the big guys (NBA and D-1 type players) There may be a lot more things going on to watch than the guys feet. If you are truly refereeing the defense, the ball handler may be secondary especially in a game with screens, rolls, etc. The offenders feet are the last place I may be looking when reffing fast big guys going at each other.

2) How many travel calls are you going to call a night. If you are a purist AND and called exactly by the rules, bring your sleeping bag because you'll be there all night ( how bout a blown whistle every time down the floor) There are lots of travels we dont call each game. We miss a lot of them because it might have looked like a good basketball move, or we did call it because it was out of place and player got an advantage...

My thoughts.....

We're just making up excuses for some officials that are not doing a particularly good job at calling a certain part of the game. Obvious travels are being missed. And some of 'em are obvious to Stevie Wonder. Of course, if there's was any doubt at all, you don't make the call. It's always been that way. But now, it seems that there's a lot of "no doubters" being missed. If you call it by the rules, and it ain't as difficult as what you're saying imo, the players will adjust in one helluva hurry.

There's just way too much analysis anymore and not enough of "just call the damn game".

Jmo.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by NBA PHILOSOPHY

Hey all those fans did not pay to hear you blow the whistle...

Originally Posted by just another ref

We hear this all the time. It doesn't fly with me...

It may not fly with you but you ain't paying anyone's salary. Do you think it's an accident that those obvious travels aren't being called?

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Unfortunately, that'd true....and that's exactly why the NBE is such a joke today......and if you do any reading, it's also why the NBE seems to have about zero credibility left when it comes to it's officiating philosophies. Nobody, and I mean nobody, can seem to come up with any idea of what a travel or a foul actually is anymore.

Careful JR! Heaven forbid that anyone hint that something's not being called properly.

Originally Posted by just another ref

We hear this all the time. It doesn't fly with me. Kobe is arguably the best player in the world at this time. If he doesn't know how to dunk without committing a violation, he needs to just lay it up.

You obviously didn't see last night's game. For some to compare Kobe to Jordan is ridiculous.

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

It may not fly with you but you ain't paying anyone's salary. Do you think it's an accident that those obvious travels aren't being called?

WTF does that have to do with it? Whether he's paying anybody's salary or not, a traveling violation on a superstar shouldn't be ignored.

That's just plain stupid.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

WTF does that have to do with it? Whether he's paying anybody's salary or not, a traveling violation on a superstar shouldn't be ignored.

That's just plain stupid.

WTF is has to do with it is do you really think NBA officials are "missing" obvious travels? Or would common sense tell you that the NBA's philosophy is to let certain travels go?

[BktBallRef]

Please show me the post where I wrote that NBA officials are "missing" obvious travels.

And please tell me where I can find the NBA Philosophy book. Is it available inline?

I have an NBA Rules Book. I know what it says. If you're the NBA and write your own rules, then why not re-write the damn rule if you're not going to call it?

Face it! The NBA allows traveling. When you can watch an entire game and not see but one or two...NO...when you don't see a single traveling call, then they are allowing it.

And college basketball is heading down the same path. Right Scrapper?

Still waiting for BNR to tell me why it matters that JAR doesn't pay anyone's salary.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

Here some of my thoughts on this.

1) I firmly believe that one of the reasons that an "obvious travel" gets missed at a higher level may becaue it wasn't that obvious. If you are in a game with the big guys (NBA and D-1 type players) There may be a lot more things going on to watch than the guys feet. If you are truly refereeing the defense, the ball handler may be secondary especially in a game with screens, rolls, etc. The offenders feet are the last place I may be looking when reffing fast big guys going at each other.

C'mon Kelvin, this aint all that hard to figure out, we non-big timers do this all the time.

If the matchup is in your primary referee the defense, look for body contact, etc.

If you're outside you watch for the pivot foot.

But Scrappy already told us he will not come in with a travel call if it's not in his primary. So he's saying the primary has to do all the work which we agree means the travels get overlooked.

QED.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

And college basketball is heading down the same path.

Well.......

As Hank Nichols posted in his NCAA bulletin of Feb.12 of this year, one of his concerns was traveling. His comment was "Adjudication of the traveling rules has been inconsistent, especially at the end of a dribble. This is true for players driving to the basket as well as post players making a move to the basket. Officials need to concentrate better on where the offensive player's pivot foot is when he picks up a dribble. The guidelines are clear and officials need to make a much more consistent effort in calling violations for illegal pivot foot movements."

NOTE: Translated so that Dan_ref can understand-- "I don't want to see any more of that damn step step dunk sh!t!"

When it comes down from the Mount, there has to be a concern.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

But Scrappy already told us he will not come in with a travel call if it's not in his primary. So he's saying the primary has to do all the work which we agree means the travels get overlooked.

Whoa! Whoa! Whoa!!! We were talking about a particular play that was described by BNR, which was a 1-on-0 breakaway dunk. In that situation, there's no defense to referee, so I'm going to let my partner make that call in his/her primary.

And being a Presidential election year, I made sure to say that I "might" not make it from the C. If it's an obvious travel from the 3-point line (like Jurassic mentioned in another thread), then I would think somebody would have to make it, even if it makes the primary official look bad.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

Whoa! Whoa! Whoa!!! We were talking about a particular play that was described by BNR, which was a 1-on-0 breakaway dunk. In that situation, there's no defense to referee, so I'm going to let my partner make that call in his/her primary.

And being a Presidential election year, I made sure to say that I "might" not make it from the C. If it's an obvious travel from the 3-point line (like Jurassic mentioned in another thread), then I would think somebody would have to make it, even if it makes the primary official look bad.

Well, IMO you're on that slippery slope and trying to hold on.

In my exchange with you I NEVER qualified the play as a 1 - 0 breakaway dunk.

All I asked was do you routinely pass on step step dunk.

You said no but you won't reach out of your primary to take it.

I can understand if you want to go back & reframe the discussion.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

In my exchange with you I NEVER qualified the play as a 1 - 0 breakaway dunk.

Dan_ref, I mean this with no malice, but that is complete BS. Go back and read your own post #38. You directly quote BNR's 1-on-0 scenario. So you referenced the breakaway and that's what I said I would likely pass on. That's what I've been discussing this whole time.

I guess it's true that the first thing to go when you get old is. . . Um. . . What's the first thing to go, again?

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

NOTE: Translated so that Dan_ref can understand-- "I don't want to see any more of that damn step step dunk sh!t!"

Thanks for the translation.