Massachusetts and Post-Game Handshake/Round 2

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Neither. I completely disregarded it as being a very weak excuse used to cover up your singular lack of ethics.

Do what you have to do. I don't have to officiate with you. Hell, I feel like I should go wash my hands after just typing this out for you.

Word.

[Adam]

What I don't understand is the purpose behind asking the officials to stick around. The state thinks they've removed the jurisdiction of the officials by fiat, in order to avoid the possibility of a stupid coach getting himself a post-game T that costs his team the game. (Now this stupid coach can say what he wants with impunity.) So, without jurisdiction, why have the officials stick around? Warm and fuzzies?

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

What I don't understand is the purpose behind asking the officials to stick around.

Pissing content IMO

"Hey why don't you do this?"
"Are you nuts? We'll never do this."
"You won't, eh? We'll see..."

Happens every day in real life.

[BayStateRef]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

I believe IAABO is the training/certification body in MA. If this is the case then I doubt that even your own insurance policy (home owner, NASO, whatever) will cover you for these games since you are going against IAABO's policy & procedure.

I'm not one to usually bring up the threat of a lawsuit when discussing these things but in this case I think it's safe to say that all bets are off once you knowingly go against the advice of the body that trains you. And not just for the post game handshake.

The insurance liability was resolved a while ago. IAABO went to the insurance carrier, who agreed to cover the post-game handshake for regular season games for an additional premium. The MIAA agreed to pay the additional premium, which I heard is about $1 per official. According to my board treasurer, $13 of our dues is for insurance. The MIAA said it has insurance for its tournament.

But don't let this insurance liability issue cloud the real issue. This is about power and control. The MIAA wants to run its tournaments and its games its own ways. Many officials had no problems this year staying an extra 30 seconds for the handhake. Others did as they always have...and left the gym at once.

My IAABO board has given full backing to officials -- regardless of their choice. There was no directive that we had to stay. My assignors said the same thing: the choice was mine.

It does appear that the state tournament will use 2-person crews for the early games because there are not enough qualified officials to work 3-person games until the quarter finals. Two-person is the norm for the vast majority of regular season games here, but the state tournament went to 3-person crews for all games two years ago.

[BayStateRef]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

What I don't understand is the purpose behind asking the officials to stick around. The state thinks they've removed the jurisdiction of the officials by fiat, in order to avoid the possibility of a stupid coach getting himself a post-game T that costs his team the game. (Now this stupid coach can say what he wants with impunity.) So, without jurisdiction, why have the officials stick around? Warm and fuzzies?

The MIAA went to the NFHS and got a ruling that the officials game jurisdiction ends when the referee approves the final score -- not when the officials leave the confines of the gym. We have been told that a nod or a "thumbs up" or "Yes, the score is right" is good enough. Any action after that, while we are still on the court, is to be penalized under MIAA sportsmanship rules, not as part of the game. So if a coach or player says a magic word after you have approved the score, it will have no bearing on the game, but could end up with a disqualification from future games.

As for the purpose, I will let the MIAA speak for itself. This is directly from the MIAA:

The mission of education-based athletics is quite different than the mission of other basketball organizations for which you may also officiate. We have a strong commitment to both exemplary sportsmanship, and to improving the culture/climate associated with school activities in all of the 34 sports recognized by the MIAA.

The vote of our policy-making Council (MIAC) with regard to contest officials’ presence for post-game handshakes in all sports was viewed by Council members to be a significant step in advancing both sportsmanship and improving game culture/climate. Contest officials are uniquely and critically important to all of the 100,000 competitions which take place among our high schools annually. The officials’ presence during this end-of-game ceremony sends a positive message. That participation closes a circle of mutual respect among all of the principal game participants (i.e. student athletes, coaches, and contest officials).

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by BayStateRef

The insurance liability was resolved a while ago. IAABO went to the insurance carrier, who agreed to cover the post-game handshake for regular season games for an additional premium. The MIAA agreed to pay the additional premium, which I heard is about $1 per official. According to my board treasurer, $13 of our dues is for insurance. The MIAA said it has insurance for its tournament.

Well I just read that ma_ref thinks it has not been resolved, and it's still my opinion that any decent lawyer will rip you guys to shreds if something bad happens at any point in the game regardless of your insurance coverage or whether you planned on staying for the pghs or not.

But it's not my problem, so good luck to you all.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BayStateRef

As for the purpose, I will let the MIAA speak for itself. This is directly from the MIAA:

The mission of education-based athletics is quite different than the mission of other basketball organizations for which you may also officiate. We have a strong commitment to both exemplary sportsmanship, and to improving the culture/climate associated with school activities in all of the 34 sports recognized by the MIAA.

The vote of our policy-making Council (MIAC) with regard to contest officials’ presence for post-game handshakes in all sports was viewed by Council members to be a significant step in advancing both sportsmanship and improving game culture/climate. Contest officials are uniquely and critically important to all of the 100,000 competitions which take place among our high schools annually. The officials’ presence during this end-of-game ceremony sends a positive message. That participation closes a circle of mutual respect among all of the principal game participants (i.e. student athletes, coaches, and contest officials).

You misspelled "warm and fuzzies." I'm just sayin'.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by BayStateRef

The officials’ presence during this end-of-game ceremony sends a positive message.

It's a show. It's actually referred to as a post-game "celebration". We're not there to supervise it. We're there to be part of the sportsmanship celebration.

With a couple hundred people 20 feet behind us.

And no security.

Absolutely insane.

[BayStateRef]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

Well I just read that ma_ref thinks it has not been resolved, and it's still my opinion that any decent lawyer will rip you guys to shreds if something bad happens at any point in the game regardless of your insurance coverage or whether you planned on staying for the pghs or not.

But it's not my problem, so good luck to you all.

Directly from the Mass. State Basketball Officials Assn. letter to members of Jan. 27:
"At that meeting (Jan. 10) both liability and safety was discussed. It was determined that we would look in to purchasing insurance to resolve the liability issue (this, in fact, has been resolved)."

It is a done deal, no matter what others are saying.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by BayStateRef

Directly from the Mass. State Basketball Officials Assn. letter to members of Jan. 27:
"At that meeting (Jan. 10) both liability and safety was discussed. It was determined that we would look in to purchasing insurance to resolve the liability issue (this, in fact, has been resolved)."

It is a done deal, no matter what others are saying.

Good luck with that, it aint my house we're talking about.

[ma_ref]

Originally Posted by BayStateRef

Directly from the Mass. State Basketball Officials Assn. letter to members of Jan. 27:
"At that meeting (Jan. 10) both liability and safety was discussed. It was determined that we would look in to purchasing insurance to resolve the liability issue (this, in fact, has been resolved)."

It is a done deal, no matter what others are saying.

Yes that issue has been resolved, but actually purchasing the additional coverage was contingent upon resolving the other matter - security of the officials during the pghs. Since the security issue still hasn't been resolved, the extra insurance was never actually purchased, and officials working the tournament are doing so at their own risk of liability.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

I don't remember who said it in this thread, but he was correct when he said that the school and its adult representatives are the responsible for the conduct of its student-athletes, not the game offidials. Once the game is over and the R has approved the final score, the officials are supposed to leave the floor immediately and they should do it together. The "brainless twits" at the MIAA should read the NFHS Officials Manual or since the MIAA uses IAABO officials should read the IAABO High School Handbook. Furthermore, the "brainless twits" at the MIAA should just ask some of its peers around the country for an opinion about their stupid idea. If the MIAA wants the post-game handshake policed then it needs to mandate the schools involved provide enough adminstrator/teachers at the game to perform such a function because these are the people who are really responsible for teaching sportsmanship to student-athletes.

Any official who would stay on the cour to watch the post-game handshake is nuts. And as far as the tournament, there is no way I would accept an assignment that would require me to stay on the cour to watch the post-game handshake. Any official who does accept such an assignment is telling everybody involved that he doesn't care about his own safety or the safety of his fellow basketball officials.

MTD, Sr.

[BayStateRef]

From an email the MIAA sent to officials Friday night:
The MIAA has extended the deadline for officials to enroll and work the state tournament. It also announced that it was cutting all ties with the Mass. State Basketball Officials Assn. and would remove MSBOA representatives from all MIAA committees. It said it would work with individual IAABO boards and independent boards to insure that officials are represented on MIAA committees.

(Now also posted on the MIAA Web site):
http://miaa.net/Basketball-Official-Email-feb8.htm

The MIAA said that it would be using 2-person crews through regional quarter-final games, unless the additional enrollment adds enough qualified officials to use 3-person crews.

Saturday's Boston Globe has a detailed article that was written before the email was sent:
http://www.boston.com/sports/schools...ouchy_subject/

[BayStateRef]

Interesting, balanced article on the handshake controversy:
http://www.thesunchronicle.com/artic...s/sports10.txt

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BayStateRef

Interesting, balanced article on the handshake controversy:
http://www.thesunchronicle.com/artic...s/sports10.txt

From the article:
"Nowadays, officials run off the court the second the final buzzer sounds. The rules still state that they are supposed to sign the official scorebook at the close of the game, but that hasn't been fully enforced in many years in the effort to get them off the court and out of harm's way."

I'm pretty sure that this isn't a NFHS rule, but I believe that Massachusetts uses NCAA rules. Is signing the book an NCAA rule?