Where is your focus?

[blindzebra]

There is rebounding action on nearly every shot I don't care where you are or what level you work there is not a potential BI/GT on nearly every shot.

So disagree with the odds all you want, it doesn't change the fact that the potential for illegal contact during rebounding action far outweighs the potential for a ball violation.

This is even more of an issue with only two officials, where making decisions on priorities is even greater.

That said, of course you can't tunnel vision on either, but you do need to put more focus on rebounding action with ball flight getting a secondary look.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by blindzebra

There is rebounding action on nearly every shot

Geeze, that's some terrible shooting you get to see in your area.

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

Geeze, that's some terrible shooting you get to see in your area.

Dan, do you not agree that there is generally "rebounding action" on every shot, regardless of whether a rebound actually happens?

We've gotten away from the original question and instead are having silly squabbles. My main point was that watching the flight of the ball is not what I'm going to be doing. I'm going to be watching the players, first and foremost. This will allow me to watch for BI and GT. I'll also be aware of the ball so I can get it hitting a support or going over the backboard.

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by jdw3018

Dan, do you not agree that there is generally "rebounding action" on every shot, regardless of whether a rebound actually happens?

Better question is whether there is rebounding action I might care about on every shot.

The answer simply is that it depends. But if the ball goes in "rebounding action' generally amounts to heads up, legs flexed, establishing position. The real rebounding action comes when the ball misses.

But if I'm T in a 2 man game (not doing much of that anymore but I've done my share) I'm watching (my priority is) the flight of the ball on the release, unless the shot comes out of my area then I'm watching (my priority is) to make sure the shooter doesn't get mugged. Then I'm watching (my priority is) the flight of the ball. Then off the miss I'm watching (my priority is) the rebounding. And in there somewhere I'm checking to see that the shot clock got handled properly if it applies.

Pretty simple. My 'priority' depends on where in the sequence I am. The sequence doesn't change very often.

[Bearfanmike20]

I think I also agree with nevada....

You watch the players first.... IMO.

[chartrusepengui]

I think part of the problem in 2 man - is that the trail tends to position self too low - I've seen them position like C in 3 person. In that position - everything is larger and it is difficult to look through play and see everything he is supposed to. By moving back a step or two or three - angles change and it is far easier to see both backside rebounding action as well as the basket and ball in flight.

[Bearfanmike20]

Originally Posted by chartrusepengui

I think part of the problem in 2 man - is that the trail tends to position self too low - I've seen them position like C in 3 person. In that position - everything is larger and it is difficult to look through play and see everything he is supposed to. By moving back a step or two or three - angles change and it is far easier to see both backside rebounding action as well as the basket and ball in flight.

I find this funny cause many experienced refs will say to step up the the ft line extended to get a closer view when things break down into the lane and walk back out when play opens up outside.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by jdw3018

My main point was that watching the flight of the ball is not what I'm going to be doing. I'm going to be watching the players, first and foremost.

You might get away with that at the JV level and in womens ball. When the game is being played above the rim, good luck to you. It will come back to bite you.

Jmho.

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

You might get away with that at the JV level and in womens ball. When the game is being played above the rim, good luck to you. It will come back to bite you.

Jmho.

JR, do you advocate watching the ball from the time it is released on a try until it is either clearly made or clearly missed, then?

I just can't agree with that. I watch the players - including those who may be able to commit goaltending, and as the shot approaches the rim I then watch the basket/ball for BI. But I always get a fix on where the players are and what they're doing as the shot goes up. It let's me have a much better idea of what's happening on rebounding action if the shot is missed.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by jdw3018

JR, do you advocate watching the ball from the time it is released on a try until it is either clearly made or clearly missed, then?

I advocate the sequence that DanRef wrote. As trail, I've got my priorities. My partner has his. My partner's priority is the players in his area under the hoop. I trust him to do his job while I'm doing mine.

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

I advocate the sequence that DanRef wrote. As trail, I've got my priorities. My partner has his. My partner's priority is the players in his area under the hoop. I trust him to do his job while I'm doing mine.

I appreciate the responses. This is an area I'm still learning, as I've just recently begun officiating games with a lot of play above the rim. You've given me a lot to think about.

In reality, this all happens very quickly, and in a 2-man game as described it's impossible to see everything. I may try your sequence (as described by Dan) next time I've got a 2-man game to see how it goes.

I totally respect your opinion but keep coming back to the L having the shooter and his landing while T is watching the flight of the ball, it seems there are a lot of players with no eyes on them...

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

You might get away with that at the JV level and in womens ball. When the game is being played above the rim, good luck to you. It will come back to bite you.

Jmho.

I was thinking the same thing. But people get so sensitive around here about Women's ball or not working varsity, I thought I would pass. I am glad you said it first.

Peace

[blindzebra]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

Geeze, that's some terrible shooting you get to see in your area.

So I guess players don't fight for position and box out on made shots around your area, huh?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by blindzebra

There is rebounding action on nearly every shot I don't care where you are or what level you work there is not a potential BI/GT on nearly every shot.

Can you have either of these things without the player? So how can you call a GT or BI without the actions of a player being watched?

Originally Posted by blindzebra

So disagree with the odds all you want, it doesn't change the fact that the potential for illegal contact during rebounding action far outweighs the potential for a ball violation.

Once again that is your opinion. And because I only work 3 Person games, I would not consider this an either/or situation. In many cases I might not watch the ball at all. Then again that is me.

Originally Posted by blindzebra

This is even more of an issue with only two officials, where making decisions on priorities is even greater.

You are probably right, but I still feel I can watch both rather equally. And if they want that play covered better, hire a 3rd official and they will be all over that play.

Originally Posted by blindzebra

That said, of course you can't tunnel vision on either, but you do need to put more focus on rebounding action with ball flight getting a secondary look.

Again I take the issue with the term "need" in your sentence. And I have heard a lot more complaining over when the ball hits the support or when there is a basket that counts that should not over contact during a rebound. Then again, that is my experience. That is why I disagree with what is more important.

Peace