Scorebook/Scoreboard Error at End of Game

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

If one asked the referee in the lockerroom what the final score was and which team won the game, what answer would you get?

At some level that matters!

Of course, there is a case book play about the ref not knowing that the U counted a goal at the horn.

I'm not trying to start a fight on this, but I have to say I'm surprised at your thoughts here. I would think that the rules regarding the running total of the official being final in matters of disagreement would be overwhelmingly compelling in this case. Even if the perception of the participants had to be corrected at a later time or date. Otherwise, why keep an official book?

But I certainly would not want to be the person who had to make the phone calls to straighten out the mess; nor would I want to be the referee who got a call from that person!

[Nevadaref]

My response was not intended to carry one shred of animosity.

If it came across that way, I apologize. It was meant to signify the shock that the referee would express in learning that the opposing team was victorious. It would certainly make a mockery of the final bit of game action.

I truly don't know the official ruling on this, so there is no way that I could even get into a "fight" about this issue and certainly not with you. You've always been cool. I just would take all measures possible to never serve as the test case which sets the precedent!

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

In such a case, I would have to argue that the approved final score is what was on the board. Perhaps the NFHS will give us an official ruling someday.

The NFHS issued an official ruling before you were born, and that official ruling has never changed. The official ruling (amazingly enough) is in the official rules.

Rule 2-11-4..."The scorer shall record the field goals made, the free throws made and missed, and keep a running summary of the points scored."

Rule 2-11-11...."If the mistake cannot be found, the referee shall accept the record of the OFFICIAL SCOREBOOK, unless he/she has knowledge which permits him/her to decide otherwise. If the discrepancy is in the score and the mistake is not resolved, the referee shall accept the progressive team totals of the OFFICIAL SCOREBOOK."

OFFICIAL SCOREBOOK!!!

If the scoreboard and the scorebook don't match at any time during the game, are you really advocating that we should accept the scoreboard?

Rule 5-3..."The winning team is the one which has accumulated the greater number of points when the game ends as in 2-2-4."

Do you deliberately bring up nonsense like this to confuse newer officials?

[Dan_ref]

So what I think you're saying is in this case we go by what is in the official scorebook ...

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

So what I think you're saying is in this case we go by what is in the official scorebook ...

Thank you.

[mkiogima]

I'm not sure but I think there might be something in the rules about an "Official Scorebook".

[Adam]

Is the scoreboard even referenced in the rule book?

[kbilla]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

The NFHS issued an official ruling before you were born, and that official ruling has never changed. The official ruling (amazingly enough) is in the official rules.

Rule 2-11-4..."The scorer shall record the field goals made, the free throws made and missed, and keep a running summary of the points scored."

Rule 2-11-11...."If the mistake cannot be found, the referee shall accept the record of the OFFICIAL SCOREBOOK, unless he/she has knowledge which permits him/her to decide otherwise. If the discrepancy is in the score and the mistake is not resolved, the referee shall accept the progressive team totals of the OFFICIAL SCOREBOOK."

OFFICIAL SCOREBOOK!!!

If the scoreboard and the scorebook don't match at any time during the game, are you really advocating that we should accept the scoreboard?

Rule 5-3..."The winning team is the one which has accumulated the greater number of points when the game ends as in 2-2-4."

Do you deliberately bring up nonsense like this to confuse newer officials?

ha ha! it's amazing what one can come up with when one applies the basics, well done! so just from a procedural point of view, how would this be fixed, and what would be the statute of limitations on something like this? what if the next day the home coach looked at the book and realized that it was wrong and confirmed with the visiting team, etc.....i guess it would have to be handled by the state association....hard to believe this could actually happen, but i suppose it could...

[Adam]

Originally Posted by kbilla

ha ha! it's amazing what one can come up with when one applies the basics, well done! so just from a procedural point of view, how would this be fixed, and what would be the statute of limitations on something like this? what if the next day the home coach looked at the book and realized that it was wrong and confirmed with the visiting team, etc.....i guess it would have to be handled by the state association....hard to believe this could actually happen, but i suppose it could...

Take it up with the state, you're right.
Once I leave the court, the book is approved. The state will need to determine the reality of the final score, or if the book has it tied, the state will determine whether OT is played.

regardless, it's a good reminder to pay attention to the table towards the end of a close game.

[kbilla]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Take it up with the state, you're right.
Once I leave the court, the book is approved. The state will need to determine the reality of the final score, or if the book has it tied, the state will determine whether OT is played.

regardless, it's a good reminder to pay attention to the table towards the end of a close game.

here's another one, what if they looked at the book an hour, day, whatever, later and realized that the game was actually tied?

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Rule 2-11-4..."The scorer shall record the field goals made, the free throws made and missed, and keep a running summary of the points scored."

Rule 2-11-11...."If the mistake cannot be found, the referee shall accept the record of the OFFICIAL SCOREBOOK, unless he/she has knowledge which permits him/her to decide otherwise. If the discrepancy is in the score and the mistake is not resolved, the referee shall accept the progressive team totals of the OFFICIAL SCOREBOOK."

OFFICIAL SCOREBOOK!!!

If the scoreboard and the scorebook don't match at any time during the game, are you really advocating that we should accept the scoreboard?

Rule 5-3..."The winning team is the one which has accumulated the greater number of points when the game ends as in 2-2-4."

So, picture this. Scoreboard says team A leads by 1 in the last minute. During a time out, the referee checks to be sure that the book and the scoreboard agree and is assured that they do. A runs outs the clock and begins to celebrate. The officials leave the court. Scorer looks down, "Oh, silly me! I looked at the board wrong. B is actually up by one. I guess they win."

Is there a specific documented procedure for this situation?

[Dan_ref]

Originally Posted by just another ref

So, picture this. Scoreboard says team A leads by 1 in the last minute. During a time out, the referee checks to be sure that the book and the scoreboard agree and is assured that they do. A runs outs the clock and begins to celebrate. The officials leave the court. Scorer looks down, "Oh, silly me! I looked at the board wrong. B is actually up by one. I guess they win."

Is there a specific documented procedure for this situation?

Yes.

They lose.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Dan_ref

Yes.

They lose.

Who loses?

[rainmaker]

Originally Posted by just another ref

So, picture this. Scoreboard says team A leads by 1 in the last minute. During a time out, the referee checks to be sure that the book and the scoreboard agree and is assured that they do. A runs outs the clock and begins to celebrate. The officials leave the court. Scorer looks down, "Oh, silly me! I looked at the board wrong. B is actually up by one. I guess they win."

Is there a specific documented procedure for this situation?

I was wondering when anyone ever looks at the book, if there's no reason. I mean, seriously what if the wrong score shows up in the paper? That's still not official, I know, but does anyone really actually look at the book? Routinely?

[Mark Dexter]

Originally Posted by rainmaker

I was wondering when anyone ever looks at the book, if there's no reason. I mean, seriously what if the wrong score shows up in the paper? That's still not official, I know, but does anyone really actually look at the book? Routinely?

Not sure if anyone ever does go back and look in the book, but I always mark the final score in ink just in case. I also constantly check the scores in the last few minutes of any game and will signal the R with a "thumbs up" after the horn if everything matches.

Hopefully the scorer learned from this. I've (thankfully) always been lucky enough to only have my errors occur with plenty of time left on the clock.