New time out mechanic

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by mick

I don't like it because of its singular flaw.

Preceding a throw-in at the division line, the administering official cannot see the table through the the free official's backside.

Geeze, mick - how big is your partner's backside?

[M&M Guy]

I think the purpose of this mechanic is communication - at some point a coach or asst. is going to stick their head out of the huddle and ask where the ball is going to be put in play, and having an official stand at the spot of the throw-in communicates that information easier. Also, late in the game when the officials are getting together to discuss their end-of-game strategy, leaving the ball at the spot of the throw-in also communicates that info to the teams.

In NCAA-W, the mechanic for the last couple of years was to put the ball down on the floor at the spot of the throw-in, even if the official was standing next to it. I thought the same thing Jeff did - someone would trip over it, steal it, or kick it away, but that never happened to me, or to anyone else I know. The reason given for changing the mechanic back this year to the official holding the ball at the spot was because the rules committee didn't like the "unprofessional" way the officials were picking up the ball after the TO. Some officials would pound on it and bounce it up, others would put their foot under it and kick it up; these methods are not as "professional" looking as simply bending over and picking it up.

[mick]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Geeze, mick - how big is your partner's backside?

Ha! just sayin'.... Just sayin'....
...Especially when it's a full timeout and partner is on circle, away from the table, you'll feel like yer 'shut out', if you ever work two-whistle.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by mick

Ha! just sayin'.... Just sayin'....
...Especially when it's a full timeout and partner is on circle, away from the table, you'll feel like yer 'shut out', if you ever work two-whistle.

That's why in those cases I just take a step or two to the side. (Usually depending on which side the cheerleaders are on...is that mentioned in the mechanics manual?)

[mick]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

That's why in those cases I just take a step or two to the side. (Usually depending on which side the cheerleaders are on...is that mentioned in the mechanics manual?)

Go ahead. Enjoy the cheerleaders.
I wish they were somewhere else, ...in another room perhaps.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by mick

Go ahead. Enjoy the cheerleaders.
I wish they were somewhere else, ...in another room perhaps.

Ha, yourself! You're assuming I automatically want to be closer. I just want the option some nights.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

In NCAA-W, the mechanic for the last couple of years was to put the ball down on the floor at the spot of the throw-in, even if the official was standing next to it. I thought the same thing Jeff did - someone would trip over it, steal it, or kick it away, but that never happened to me, or to anyone else I know.

What works at the NCAA level does not always work very well at the HS level. Cheerleaders at the HS level are not as smart. And I have seen officials put the ball on the floor and I have seen cheerleaders almost trip over the ball. I almost ran into a cheerleader that was flipping on the court during a 30 second timeout (because cheerleaders are stupid).

The bottom line is I might use the mechanic on a case by case basis. But I think the ball on the floor only takes one time for there to be a really problem.

Peace

[M&M Guy]

Maybe mick's right - we just need to send them to another room?...

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Maybe mick's right - we just need to send them to another room?...

If there were no cheerleaders, I probably would be OK with this mechanic.

The last time I checked, NCAA-W Basketball does not have cheerleaders.

Peace

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by mick

Ha! just sayin'.... Just sayin'....
...Especially when it's a full timeout and partner is on circle, away from the table, you'll feel like yer 'shut out', if you ever work two-whistle.

But if my partner is female and nicely constructed, this could be a bonus. I'm just sayin'

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Geeze, mick - how big is your partner's backside?

I think this is her. And no - that is NOT Juulie!

Originally Posted by JRutledge

In my state, most coaches never attend a single rules meeting. Coaches know very little about mechanics in detail. I bet most coaches have no idea there has been a change. It is only required for a school to be represented each year from each school. That usually means the first year freshman B coach that has never coached before at the HS level attends these meetings. And they do not do a very good job passing along the information because most varsity coaches are surprised by many rules that are implemented. Secondly my state pretty much does 3 Person the entire season in most games (I am not working a single 2 Man varsity game this season and I work in multiple areas). Also all coaches can do is rate us, they have no recommendation opportunities. And I seriously doubt that any coach is going to care more about a silly mechanic used as compared to someone not being able to call a game properly.

So the last thing I am going to worry about is if I do not use this mechanic how it will directly affect me in my advancement. I am sure there are more things to it than this single mechanic.

Peace

Well, duh, if you are doing varsity and only 3-man, then it's a moot point. However, if you do subvarsity 2-man, and your partner goes to the correct spot and you don't, I guaranty the varsity refs watching your game (probably from halftime on), will notice it. Refs in the stands will notice it. If the scheduler is in the stands or some other rules official, he/she will notice it. And they will all start from that obvious flaw and search for more - and soon decide if they want to work with you or not.

My thought on this is why kick advancement opportunity in the backside over an obvious mechanic. Let them downgrade you over not performing a "pinch in" move on a breakaway, but not THIS!

Plus, when your partner has the ball at the endline, go ahead and stand on the low block right by him then walk all the way up the court to signal first horn to the visiting team. That would look goofy to almost everyone.

But hey, it's your career! Stand up for your principles!

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by KSRef07

However, if you do subvarsity 2-man, and your partner goes to the correct spot and you don't, I guaranty the varsity refs watching your game (probably from halftime on), will notice it. Refs in the stands will notice it. If the scheduler is in the stands or some other rules official, he/she will notice it. And they will all start from that obvious flaw and search for more - and soon decide if they want to work with you or not.

My thought on this is why kick advancement opportunity in the backside over an obvious mechanic. Let them downgrade you over not performing a "pinch in" move on a breakaway, but not THIS!

I both assign, train and evaluate. If I'm evaluating somebody for advancement, someone standing in the wrong place during a TO would have absolutely no bearing at all on my decision as to whether they're ready for a higher level. It's just about the most minor concern that you could get, and is also just about the easiest to correct.

I want to know if someone can actually officiate. I could care less about piddly-azz stuff like that. If they're out of position during play, then you do have a problem. During a TO, it just isn't a biggie. If they wanna go boogaloo with the cheerleaders, I could care less.

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

I both assign, train and evaluate. If I'm evaluating somebody for advancement, someone standing in the wrong place during a TO would have absolutely no bearing at all on my decision as to whether they're ready for a higher level. It's just about the most minor concern that you could get, and is also just about the easiest to correct.

I want to know if someone can actually officiate. I could care less about piddly-azz stuff like that. If they're out of position during play, then you do have a problem. During a TO, it just isn't a biggie. If they wanna go boogaloo with the cheerleaders, I could care less.

I agree. However, here you have a guy REFUSING to do it when he knows he should. It goes to state of mind and what ELSE he will refuse to do on the court - not call handchecking? Rough post play? It's a renegade mentality.

[mick]

Originally Posted by KSRef07

Well, duh, if you are doing varsity and only 3-man, then it's a moot point. However, if you do subvarsity 2-man, and your partner goes to the correct spot and you don't, I guaranty the varsity refs watching your game (probably from halftime on), will notice it. Refs in the stands will notice it. If the scheduler is in the stands or some other rules official, he/she will notice it. And they will all start from that obvious flaw and search for more - and soon decide if they want to work with you or not.

My thought on this is why kick advancement opportunity in the backside over an obvious mechanic. Let them downgrade you over not performing a "pinch in" move on a breakaway, but not THIS!

Plus, when your partner has the ball at the endline, go ahead and stand on the low block right by him then walk all the way up the court to signal first horn to the visiting team. That would look goofy to almost everyone.

But hey, it's your career! Stand up for your principles!

The mechanic says "the adminstering official may set the ball down".
It does not say *should set*, *must set*.

I'm with Rut. I won't do it.