Which takes precedence in the following scenario:

[Old School]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

By the way, the correct answer to this play is that the shooter gets to shoot two or three free throws (depending upon whether he was fouled attempting a two or three-point field goal).

MTD, Sr.

I would disagree with that. The only reason you are saying 2 or 3 shot foul is because the OP said he jumped to shoot. However, since he didn't actually shoot the ball the OP could be guessing what the intent of the player with the ball was. We should not guess, especially at intent.

I think the correct answer is you got a personal foul, and referee judgment as to if it's a 2 or 3 shot attempt, or on the floor. I have seen players dribble into the lane and have a open look at a layup, get fouled, and pass the ball at the last possible second, which makes the foul on the pass. It would be less of a judgment here but nonetheless a judgment call. Now before you go ape-sh!t-bananas, I have also seen where the shooter was awarded 2 shots even though he passed it. It all depends on our judgment.

Another thing to be cautious of here is if the ball was held where the shot attempt couldn't get off and the shooter returned to the floor with the ball. This would be a held ball. So I got in this order, foul, held ball, shooting foul, but defiantly no traveling. Player has got to give me some kind of effort to shoot the ball or it's on the floor because I'm not guessing intent.

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by Old School

Now before you go ape-sh!t-bananas

Too late.

[eg-italy]

Originally Posted by Old School

I would disagree with that. The only reason you are saying 2 or 3 shot foul is because the OP said he jumped to shoot. However, since he didn't actually shoot the ball the OP could be guessing what the intent of the player with the ball was. We should not guess, especially at intent.

And when in doubt because the player could not complete the action, give the free throws.

Originally Posted by Old School

I think the correct answer is you got a personal foul, and referee judgment as to if it's a 2 or 3 shot attempt, or on the floor. I have seen players dribble into the lane and have a open look at a layup, get fouled, and pass the ball at the last possible second, which makes the foul on the pass. It would be less of a judgment here but nonetheless a judgment call. Now before you go ape-sh!t-bananas, I have also seen where the shooter was awarded 2 shots even though he passed it. It all depends on our judgment.

Many times officials make mistakes. Of course it is a judgment call, but if a player moves as if starting a jump shot, I would say it is a shot, unless there is a pass after the foul.

Originally Posted by Old School

Another thing to be cautious of here is if the ball was held where the shot attempt couldn't get off and the shooter returned to the floor with the ball. This would be a held ball. So I got in this order, foul, held ball, shooting foul, but defiantly no traveling. Player has got to give me some kind of effort to shoot the ball or it's on the floor because I'm not guessing intent.

There was no held ball in the described play. What effort to shoot can make a player when struck strongly? Or even not strongly, but is such a way to make them lose their balance? A jump shot movement is a try for goal, unless etc. etc.

From the NCAA rule book, here is the definition of act of shooting.

The try shall start when the player begins the motion that habitually precedes the release of the ball on a try. The ball does not need to leave the player’s hand. The arm might be held so that the player cannot throw; however, he or she may be making an attempt.

I believe that NF has the same concept, which is the same also in FIBA. (Italics added by me.) The rules don't mention any "effort to shoot". There is a "may" in the final sentence, which means that the official has to see the whole play, in order to judge correctly.

At least you agree there is no travel.

Ciao

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Old School

The only reason you are saying 2 or 3 shot foul is because the OP said he jumped to shoot.

I think the correct answer is you got a personal foul, and referee judgment as to if it's a 2 or 3 shot attempt, or on the floor.

Please let me know when you're going to call "on the floor" on a foul committed on a player who's in the air trying to shoot. Damn, I gotta see that one.

You outdo even yourself sometimes. You're in a category all by yourself when it comes to moronic statements.

The OP said that he JUMPED to SHOOT!!

JUMPED!!!!

SHOOT!!!!

Put those together and you can't freaking-well have "on the floor", Cletus.

And, btw, you can still have a two or 3 shot foul called on a player who is "on the floor" anyway. The determining factor is whether the player was in the act of shooting, not whether he was "on the floor" or airborne. Real officials who actually own rule books know that.

King of the Silly Monkeys......

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Old School

Another thing to be cautious of here is if the ball was held where the shot attempt couldn't get off and the shooter returned to the floor with the ball. This would be a held ball. So I got in this order, foul, held ball, shooting foul, but defiantly no traveling.

You can defiantly add no held ball to that little sequence too.
Replace it with "end of try".

Basic rules again......