Fifth foul procedure

[OklahomaRef]

But if there is no warning, and it wasn't put on the scoreboard, how was I supposed to know how much time I had?

[mplagrow]

Originally Posted by OklahomaRef

But if there is no warning, and it wasn't put on the scoreboard, how was I supposed to know how much time I had?

Hey, we're not the ones that you have to sell on it.

[Adam]

I agree they should have warned you, and if I'd been there (and actually known the rule), I'd have told them to sound it after 20. Had they not, I'd have given you a few seconds to get the sub to the table if the first horn was at 30.
That said, trying to use this as a timeout to freeze the shooter comes with risk. What level ball was this?

[OklahomaRef]

It was at the freshmen level. I know guys it was freshmen. I still have to do all I can do in order to win the game.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by OklahomaRef

It was at the freshmen level. I know guys it was freshmen. I still have to do all I can do in order to win the game.

I was just curious, and did not mean in any way to diminish the value of the game. However, you know full well that at this level the officials may not be fully versed in the little details of the rules. Using this time instead of a timeout to ice the shooter comes with risk; especially at this level.

[OklahomaRef]

You are right, but I don't think I should have to sit since there was an error. I'm not worried about the game, I worried about having to sit. If I was not ejected, will I have to sit?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by OklahomaRef

You are right, but I don't think I should have to sit since there was an error. I'm not worried about the game, I worried about having to sit. If I was not ejected, will I have to sit?

That's up to your state association. Do officials have to report all Ts, or just ejections? If they have to report all technicals, then maybe. If they only have to report ejections, then probably not. Again, it's up to your state.
You might want to call them and offer the situation as a "hypothetical." You know, "a friend of mine was wondering...."

[mplagrow]

Originally Posted by OklahomaRef

You are right, but I don't think I should have to sit since there was an error. I'm not worried about the game, I worried about having to sit. If I was not ejected, will I have to sit?

What, in the next game you mean? That's not an NFHS rule, that may be an association rule. Appeal the case to your association and explain the circumstances. Maybe they'll let you off the hook.

[OklahomaRef]

I sent an email to the director of officials, explaining the incident. (my luck the referee probably wont even right it up) Bottom line, If i dont get a T in the first part of the game, it's not even an issue. We were down 3 with 8 seconds to go, definitely a chance to come back. It should be obvious that I wasn't trying to "show the official up", or anything like that. I hope that our association takes it into consideration.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by OklahomaRef

You are right, but I don't think I should have to sit since there was an error. I'm not worried about the game, I worried about having to sit. If I was not ejected, will I have to sit?

No offense, but why the heck do you care? It's a freakin' freshman game. You worried about losing the paycheck? If you got the required number of T's take your medicine like a big boy. It's a freakin' freshman game. Instead of worrying about the one you didn't deserve, worry about the one you did deserve. Fix that, and you don't have to worry about sitting out because some freshman level ref didn't know the rules.

[Rich]

The first horn, whether at 20 seconds or 30 seconds is MY warning horn. I'd wait another 10 seconds and then make sure a sub was ready to go.

How hard is it for the official to turn and say "give me someone?"

Can't imagine whacking a coach over this.

[mplagrow]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

No offense, but why the heck do you care? It's a freakin' freshman game. You worried about losing the paycheck? If you got the required number of T's take your medicine like a big boy. It's a freakin' freshman game. Instead of worrying about the one you didn't deserve, worry about the one you did deserve. Fix that, and you don't have to worry about sitting out because some freshman level ref didn't know the rules.

[OklahomaRef]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

No offense, but why the heck do you care? It's a freakin' freshman game. You worried about losing the paycheck? If you got the required number of T's take your medicine like a big boy. It's a freakin' freshman game. Instead of worrying about the one you didn't deserve, worry about the one you did deserve. Fix that, and you don't have to worry about sitting out because some freshman level ref didn't know the rules.

It is my job to try and win whatever I have to do (within the rules). I am trying to advance, just like I did when I was officiating. If you as a coach expect your players to give you everything they have, you have to do the same. When I got the first technical, I did not "lose it" or blow up, I asked a question (yes I was being a smart A$$), and I didn't like the answer (which included that is enough), so I said something else and got the "T". When I got the first T, I sat down, and did not get up again. (Except for T.O.'s) IThe other part of this story is I had these referees three straight days. All three games were very close, and hotly contested. I personally think that having them three days in a row probably led both parties to having their fill of each other. As for why do I care, because I care about my players

[MadCityRef]

You had to sit after the first one.
Oh, so that's why coaches like to stand all the time, they don't sitting on their brains.

[Mountaineer]

When I used to coach, I always used my full 30 seconds too. I would get my player ready and talk to him while walking him to the table. I kinda had it down timing wise perfectly. As far as the T goes - it seems a bit hasty. It sounds like younger officials who put the ball down on an oob even though the team is walking across the floor.

AS far as you sitting - you weren't ejected. Usually that is due to an ejection . . . again, since it was a freshman game it's possible the second T won't even be reported. I know of some officials that don't report T's like that . . .